Thinking about changing my 10 year old lumi's for something new and was wondering if this is a bad time of year to be buying. Most of the available lights seem to have been out around a year or more and if I buy something now will it have been superseded before Christmas?
I'd be looking at one of the more powerful lighting setups, had a look at luminous and trouts offerings and I think that is the sort of cost/performance I'd be looking to get. with the intention of hanging on to it for several years rather than upgrading every year or so.
Anyone know of anything due out in the near future that knocks the socks off what's currently available?
Just to add (as a big fan of cheap DX lights) who owns both 'last years' p7's and 'this years' XML - the new XMLs have a really tight hot spot and although the spread is the same and they are overall brighter - the old p7 is actually my preferred choice for the bars. The XML hot spot makes the rest of the field of vision seem darker in comparison - if that makes any sort of sense.
Someone will be along in a sec with the polar opposite opinion!
But to answer the op's question - no. Buy a cheapo - if you love it and have the budget and question its quality - then upgrade to a more "reliable" big brand later.
Not keen on the idea of DX lights. Not seen one in the flesh but from what I've read they appear to be budget lights for a reason.
A good deal if you're treating them as disposable or if you expect to change your lights every couple of years but I'd rather buy a better built product and keep it for as long as possible hence the 10 year old lumi's.
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Is ten years realistic for LED lights? if I'm getting say 1500 lumens out of a brand new light will I still get that after a number of years or do the LED's degenerate over their lifespan?
My point is only about the technology. P7 is broadish. XML is tightish. This wont change no matter how much you pay for brands etc.
Thanks, that is useful input. Not dismissing the DX lights for all purposes just not what I'm looking for this time.
My current lights have a beam and a flood version, I guess that's going to be similar in function to the P7 (flood) and XML (spot). Generally I do prefer the flood to the spot.
How much would the optics affect the light pattern? or is an XML always going to be a tighter beam regardless of the optics?
I am far from an expert - just a dabbler in fixing things: the xml with no optics / reflector lights up a room like a 60w bulb (maybe) but with a serious hot spot. You look at the hot spot for a minute then the rest of the room appears dark. A P7 in the same situation - is like a 40w bulb with a moderate hot spot. Less of a contrast.
That's a very simplistic comparison. Dunno if that answers your original Q though.
Better optics would take that brighter hotspot and distribute it over a wider parabola. So optics are the key to a better light.
That's where the extra cost goes to some degree.
The rest of the cost goes into better ballast and heatsinks for heat management and durability.
Skyline-GTR - Member
Better optics would take that brighter hotspot and distribute it over a wider parabola. So optics are the key to a better light.
Skyline - I disagree. The hotspot is there with a bare led with no reflector. The only thing you could do I think is put some sort of diffuser / frensel in front of the led.
Thinking about changing my 10 year old lumi's for something new and was wondering if this is a bad time of year to be buying. Most of the available lights seem to have been out around a year or more and if I buy something now will it have been superseded before Christmas?
Having a similar dilemma, but have decided now is the right time to buy, more just that what exactly to buy. I've tried a few differed offerings out briefly, and I've come to the conclusion that anything over about 1200 proper lab tested lumens (Trout Mini, Exposure Maxx-D) is a bit overkill. Nice to have but not necessry if you get me.
As far as being superseded by Christmas, well you're always going to run that risk, but how much light do you need? A Trout Lumen liberator is way more than anyone feasibly needs, so anything brighter (and he has a 2800 lumen light on it's way apparently!) is just gonna be overkill... It's like suspension travel back in the late 90's, for several years every year the bikes coming out had more and more suspension travel, and we were all wondering when it would end. Well it did end when people realised you can't feasibly pedal anything with more than about 6" of travel up a hill all day long. I think light output now will go up briefly for bragging rights, but you can already buy lights bright enough to do what you need for certain. Just how far do you need to see, as Trout's prototypes are pushing 300 metres penetration apparently!
I'd be looking at one of the more powerful lighting setups, had a look at luminous and trouts offerings and I think that is the sort of cost/performance I'd be looking to get. with the intention of hanging on to it for several years rather than upgrading every year or so.
Good plan, and this is the route I'm planning on taking. And these guys will offer upgrade routes in the future no doubt, and world class backup from what I hear.
And as far as the new DX XML lights are concerned... My brief play with one confirms it's very bright, but I found the hotspot in the middle very off-putting. It would end up giving me tunnel vision I reckon, I prefer a broader spread of smooth light myself.
First up optics/reflectors make or break a light .
the smaller the led die the better it will be for distance projecting of the light. but it can only send out a limited number of lumens
Led dies have been getting larger in the push for more lumens per watt of power going in , In readyness for leds to take over domestic lighting
The P7 MCE XML are considered to be floody leds in the geeky world of lighting
We can make a light be tight and go far or floody and not as far using the correct optics .
And it is how you use the lumens which makes a good trail light not the amount of lumens .
I agree the new XML Bastid does have a very concentrated hot spot which some folks may dislike Me I like to have a long throwing floody light if that is possible ( the best of both worlds ) I do sometimes get the WTF I thought the rac rally was coming along comment
You can see in this video beams from a few lights P7 Bastid and XML Bastid are the first 2 followed by Liberator / 2800 lumen proto / Spider eyes Half / spider eyes Full beasty
It is nice for Luminous and myself to get glowing recommendations as we try darned hard to make a good product admittedly they are not cheap when you compare the lumens Per dollar of the Bastids but they are as good if not better than more pricy lights out there .
My take on the lumen wars which does get talked about every night riding season .
Yes you can ride the trails with 200 lumens perfectly well but then your mate will get a new light and have 300 so yours will seem dim and when he is behind you you will have a shadow to ride into good fun to annoy your mates sometimes.
The beauty of leds is the controllability so you can run them at lower throttle but it is nice to have the max grunt sometimes bit like a fast car.
My old eyes need all the help they can get so I run mine at medium and low settings for 95% of the time with the odd max output for techy downs .
Cree Leds are specified for 50 000 hours of burn time at their rated amperage they will be 75% or better after the 50000 hours if they have not been overheated.
Thats is a lot of night rides which will be let down by the battery technology
as the best Li Ion cells only have a set number of charge/discharge cycles upto about 500 cycles for the best cells and who knows for the cheapie ones .
then factor in the stored during the summer time when the battery will be slowly degrading so maybe 5/ 10 years useage if we are lucky .
I am waiting for some new battery bags to arrive and then will have a demo Liberator to send out again in the next week or so if anyone wants to try one out . I have a demo Mini available for the helmet .
And as I am incapable of keeping it secret yes there will be the monster that Mboy alludes to .
though it may also be available as a self assembly kit too .
In conclusion I see the Bastids taking over the night Damn those Chinese for making cheap stuff that works .
But do hope there will be the customers who dont want bastids but something a bit different .
If your lumi's battery is still good why not get one of there led units?
Battery has just about had it.
or mod your halogen cans and use your existing batery and leads.
Crossed my mind but the charger cable is only just attached to the charger and all the connectors are pretty shonky, it only takes a little rough riding for the connectors to work loose effectively switching off the lights. So the only bit I could realistically reuse would be the cases.
Cree Leds are specified for 50 000 hours of burn time at their rated amperage they will be 75% or better after the 50000 hours if they have not been overheated.
Thats is a lot of night rides which will be let down by the battery technology
as the best Li Ion cells only have a set number of charge/discharge cycles upto about 500 cycles for the best cells and who knows for the cheapie ones .
Thanks trout, good to know that the lights themselves should outlast the batteries several times over.
So they have been ok for 10 years and your worried that what you buy next will no longer do the job in 4 months?
It's not a question of not being up to the job in 4 months, but rather not wanting to miss out on something that may have been in development and due for release once the winter hits. I don't expect that I need a greater light output than is currently available but I imagine the LED's are also becoming more energy efficient as time goes by and having a longer burn time or smaller battery is something that I would like if it were a case of just waiting a couple of months.
I upgraded from Lumi halogens to Lumi LEDs last year. Reason for sticking withe the Lumi's was that you have all the compatibility across the lamp units and batteries. So my halogen cans with glow-rings have now got low-wattage LED units in there and run off the new batteries as awesome commuter lamps etc. And I'm keen on Lumi's aftersales etc. Nowt the matter with the lights, although I'm no geek.
Believe me, the new DX XL-M will knock the tits off your old lumis. It'll be like riding in daylight, compared to the old yellow glow you are used to. And for 28 quid, really?.....
was riding the last 9 years with a lupine nightmare halogen light...
nightrides, commuting, several crashes...
it was expensive..but worth every single penny
now it is time to change to LEDs..
decided to go for trout´s LIBERATOR....will order it as soon as I´m back from the alps...
