A couple of guys in the US here are exercising their constitutional right to walk around with huge guns and troll for arguments with the attention they attract.

A policeman stops them to check that the guns are legal (ie, not fully automatic). With, well, wholly unstereotypical consequences.

http://www.liveleak.com//view?i=589_1345502474

There’s no big ‘pay-off’ moment here but nonetheless it’s an interesting video on several levels, I thought. Not least being the stark contrast between there and here as to how normal it is to waltz around with big guns, and also the professionalism of the officer.

In the UK only the police (and the criminals) waltz around with big guns.

Thanks for clearing that up.

thought this was going to be a thread about darcy 🙁

Interesting about the cop’s opinion – “with you guys around here we’re not going to have any crime”.

Surely they’re just going to scare the s*** out of a bunch of people? If I saw someone with that kind of weapon I’d hit the deck or run and call the police – can it really be that different over there? It doesn’t sound like it.

The professionalism of the officer was exemplary. The law that allows that sort of weapon to be carried openly or otherwise is just nuts.

can it really be that different over there? It doesn’t sound like it.

It’s “normal”, is the thing. They were reported for carrying what looked like full auto guns, not for carrying guns.

That in itself speaks volumes, a casual observer reports someone for carrying the wrong type of gun. As a casual observer myself, I wouldn’t know a fully automatic weapon from a bowl of soup and a porcelain model of the Queen, and I used to play Shadowrun.

Murder rate in US is about the highest in the civilised world.

NRA believe this is an argument for more guns.

People are murdered in the UK as well, and majority of them are unarmed vis-a-vis their murderer.

The law that allows that sort of weapon to be carried openly or otherwise is just nuts.

I think if you’re going to allow guns, I’d rather they were carried openly than hidden, ideally with a flashing pink neon sign that said “hey everyone, I have a gun!”

But yeah, he makes an interesting point. Not that I’m advocating it for a second, but if everyone has guns, petty crime is going to be pretty low. (Serious crime, on the other hand…)

what was disturbing was that the cop invited the ‘citizens’ along to join the reservists – i.e. he saw them as reasonable and sane people – whereas deciding to walk around in public brandishing semi-autos and bleating on about constitutional rights like some nerd would certainly rule them out as sane and trustworthy in my book.

The Swiss have a high per-capita gun ownership. Memebrs of the Swiss version of the territorial army are allowed to keep their guns at home. There are very few murder sprees in Switzerland…

I didn’t think there was any evidence that greater access to guns decreased petty crime, between the states with different gun laws.

Back when the 2nd Amendment was writen, did they have automatic guns? I thought they were all single shot, or pistols?

(Sorry I am not a gun expert)

Would anyone feel happy walking down a street, with the general public carring that sort of gun? 😯

I think its just asking for trouble and highlights what is so wrong with the US gun culture.

what was disturbing was that the cop invited the ‘citizens’ along to join the reservists – i.e. he saw them as reasonable and sane people

Or he figured, educating them wouldn’t hurt.

Back when the 2nd Amendment was writen, did they have automatic guns? I thought they were all single shot, or pistols?

Dunno. But I expect the exact details of what they are / aren’t permitted to carry and how (concealed or open) fall under state law and varies accordingly.

After my brother’s wedding in Michigan my Mum and I wanted to stroll back the short distance from his in-laws’ house to the hotel. Our hosts were horrified; there was no route through the woods around the estate and if anybody saw us walking they would assume we were burglars and shoot us!

We ended up driving about 6 miles up and down a freeway to travel 300 yards.

Or he figured, educating them wouldn’t hurt.

+1, that’s what I thought. Or that even if you’re going to have someone wandering around the streets with a gun, might as well give him some training and a badge and put him to work.

Cougar – Member

Not least being the stark contrast between there and here as to how normal it is to waltz around with big guns,

Not normal at all- that’s kind of the point. Open-carry’s quite an interesting position, these are folks that wouldn’t normally carry a large firearm but because they’re not allowed to carry concealed, they go for a bit of a reductio absurdum and say, well if I can’t carry my little 9mm, I’ll carry a cannon. People do it for all sorts of reasons.

Nice vid, anyway- didn’t go at all the way I expected it to. Not sure about the policeman’s parting comments (could be taken various ways) but the professionalism throughout was impressive.

The Swiss have a high per-capita gun ownership. Memebrs of the Swiss version of the territorial army are allowed to keep their guns at home. There are very few murder sprees in Switzerland…

I think you’ll find that easy access to cuckoo clocks and cheese with holes in tends to prevent gun crime. The evidence is there.

Or maybe easy access to guns and high polarisation of wealth is a bad combination?

TBH I was only in switzerland for a couple of hours but I think if it’d gone on much longer i’d have definately murdered an Easyjet staff member.

Or he figured, educating them wouldn’t hurt.

Yeah, I thought either that or the officer was diffusing the argument (which the weapon carrying citizens appeared to want to provoke) by using the “we are all on the same side” ploy.

The professionalism of the officer was exemplary. The law that allows that sort of weapon to be carried openly or otherwise is just nuts.

I couldn’t agree more.

The Swiss have a high per-capita gun ownership. Memebrs of the Swiss version of the territorial army are allowed to keep their guns at home. There are very few murder sprees in Switzerland…

The rate of gun homicide in Switzerland is still 8 times that of England though.

wikifacts

Oh dear, half the population are like that?

The rate of gun homicide in Switzerland is still 8 times that of England though.

Surely the rate of homicide generally is a more relevant statistic? Is that eight times higher too?

half the population are like that?

What?

just shows how different the USA’s laws are (and outdated imo)..

in comparison to the UK, those guys were ‘as armed up’ as UK armed police at airports i.e. with semi auto MP5’s

The Swiss have a high per-capita gun ownership. Memebrs of the Swiss version of the territorial army are allowed to keep their guns at home. There are very few murder sprees in Switzerland…

America has 38 times the population though 😉

Cougs, just hopping that there are more than half of “us” who don’t feel the need to walk round semi-urban areas with semi-auto (?) firearms in the middle of the day, filming interactions with police officers while spouting human rights etc (sorry crude summary) and then posting them on the Internet for posterity. 😉

Wasn’t knocking your OP post, it was interesting to watch

Check out the suicide rate in Switzerland and the method of choice.

I was a little surprised to see one poster include the US in the “civilised world”.

Cougs, just hopping that there are more than half of “us” who don’t feel the need to walk round semi-urban areas with semi-auto (?) firearms in the middle of the day, filming interactions with police officers while spouting human rights etc (sorry crude summary) and then posting them on the Internet for posterity.

Ah, it’s a reference to my subject title. Clearly, I agonised over for hours for factual accuracy before posting in order to avoid any possibility of it being randomly misunderstood. However, I’m still awaiting the results of the national census I undertook, so I decided to just risk it with what I had.

Moreover. That’s not really what I meant. My usage of “the other half” here was a tongue in cheek reference to the concept that things in two discrete countries may appear outlandish in one but accepted as normal in the other. It was sort of humour, you see, rather than intended as serious socio-political commentary. I wasn’t implying that half of the country are trolling idiots; I try to avoid rash generalisations as a rule.

Sorry for any inconvenience caused. Do not adjust your set.

I know, I was joking too 😉

Yeah, I saw the smiley, I just overlooked adding one myself. But I’d like to think that by now my posts are sufficiently consistently irreverent to carry an implied smiley by default.

In other words, if something I say can be taken two ways, and one of those ways makes you vexed, I probably meant the other one.

Murder rate in US is about the highest in the civilised world.

Is it ?

Per capita (the only sensible way to measure it) they are not even in the top 100 in the world.

Plenty of “civilised” countries well above USA.

Like the way the Plod handled that one. Perhaps we have a few who could learn from watching that video.

If that was a real encounter and not a training video it was pretty impressive. The two guys were obviously out to provoke and the cop was more than up to the task.
Somehow I can’t see a UK policeman handling the situation in the same manner 🙁

Somehow I can’t see a UK policeman handling the situation in the same manner

Yeah – a UK policeman would probably go all over the top calling in SO19 if he came across somebody in the street carrying a gun like that.

Somehow I can’t see a UK policeman handling the situation in the same manner reaching some sensationalist TV ‘documentary’ for our entertainment and Guardian reader reaction.

FTFY

Yeah, I saw the smiley, I just overlooked adding one myself. But I’d like to think that by now my posts are sufficiently consistently irreverent to carry an implied smiley by default.

In other words, if something I say can be taken two ways, and one of those ways makes you vexed, I probably meant the other one.

😆
I love use of the word ‘vexed’, always makes me smile. 😀

The Swiss have a high per-capita gun ownership. Memebrs of the Swiss version of the territorial army are allowed to keep their guns at home. There are very few murder sprees in Switzerland…

Have you tasted Swiss chocolate?

Have you tasted American chocolate?

The difference between these two products clearly explains the difference in murder spree rates IMO.

Also, I’ve been to America a few times. It’s great in a way that can’t be described unless you’ve been there but it’s also one of the most depressing places on earth, again, you have to experience attitudes to understand this. However, it’s really, really big. It’s like lots of different countries connected to each other. A bit like….errm europe.

In New York, gun ownership is not encouraged. There are good reasons for this.

In Texas, gun ownership is encouraged and trust me, people own guns a lot in Texas. I’ve been taken out to a guys truck and shown his ‘mobile gun collection. Not his full collection, just the ones he carries around with him. I saw (and I’m no gun expert), a magnum .44, an AK47 (yes, that’s an automatic weapon) and what looked like a rifle for shooting people who live in different countries to the one you are currently living in. I was assured that rifle could kill someone about a mile away.

That was a telephony guy. Not a soldier or a policeman, someone who installs small telephone exchanges.