Viewing 33 posts - 1 through 33 (of 33 total)
  • How much to pay 18yo to labour?
  • Blazin-saddles
    Free Member

    I’m a self employed kitchen and bathroom fitter in the midlands and due to an increased workload and stuff just getting too heavy to lift, I’m thinking about hiring someone to help.

    I’m quite particular in how I do stuff so want to maybe train someone over time to my standards, rather than just hire in subbies. For the meantime though I’m happy to have someone to help lift stuff, fetch and carry and brush up a bit.

    How much should I offer to pay? I notice apprenticeship min wage, which seems way too little to make it work going to work for, but on the flip side I can’t really afford to overpay at mo and not sure how much ‘value’ I’ll gain from the second pair of (for the time being) untrained hands.

    Not sure where to pitch the offer. any advice? Working hours roughly 8-4:30/5

    scotroutes
    Full Member

    There’s an argument to suggest that pitching it low gets you folk who really are interested in learning the trade. Remember also that the Govt will assist with benefits for those are too low paid.

    Why not offer a low rate and then some sort of bonus for staying the course?

    Tracker1972
    Free Member

    Might be a bit mercenary, but I would start with whatever the apprenticeship deal is, that way you will get the benefit of… whatever benefits it gives you, fixed term if they don’t have the potential you are looking for but if they are any good you can quickly and easily make it worth their while staying with you, and you will have an idea of how much work they do for you?

    thomthumb
    Free Member

    doesn’t an apprentice have to qualify at some point? i don’t think it’s just for cheap help. i could be wrong.

    RobHilton
    Free Member

    If you just want a mover & shover get down the gym in the daytime to find someone between jobs who’s motivated to get off their arse and be active with their time.

    If you actually want an apprentice offer peanuts to snare someone keen then keep giving them little rises to show you appreciate their efforts.

    muddy9mtb
    Full Member

    ring the business link or council, grants will be available if your taking on a “trainee” to cover x amount of cost. You can certainly pay them more than the min. if you so wish (and will only encourage them anyway) which could be done on a sliding scale. only problem you may have is once you’ve taken on one they may not exactly stop ringing to see if you want another..then another!?! if you get my drift

    robware
    Free Member

    Apprenticeships are a way of attaining a vocational qualification on the job. If you want to go down that route you’ll need to set yourself up with the appropriate structure to provide an apprenticeship.

    If you can’t offer the structure of an apprenticeship then minimum wage it is.

    Do the world a favour, though, and don’t be another tosser offering up an apprenticeship with no valuable outcome just because you want cheap labour.

    edhornby
    Full Member

    The living wage = £7.85 per hour

    taxi25
    Free Member

    Doesn’t an apprenticeship these days lead to a formal qualification ? Time in college ect. If you want a good reliable lad to help out and train up on the job, well in my experience don’t over pay but the less you pay the less you get.

    br
    Free Member

    How much should I offer to pay? I notice apprenticeship min wage, which seems way too little to make it work going to work for, but on the flip side I can’t really afford to overpay at mo and not sure how much ‘value’ I’ll gain from the second pair of (for the time being) untrained hands.

    To offer Apprentice wages you need to sign up to the Apprentice scheme, which includes only specific training providers.

    The alternative would be to offer minimum wages and get the best person you can get – their value will (or won’t) increase over time.

    wrecker
    Free Member

    You really need to decide whether you want a labourer

    to help lift stuff, fetch and carry and brush up a bit.

    In which case, you need to pay minimum wage AT LEAST.
    Or you want an apprentice, which is a long term commitment (and a great thing to do).

    Do not take on a kid under the auspices of an apprenticeship just so you can pay them less with no intention of giving them full training and college, as that would make you scum.

    P-Jay
    Free Member

    As BR says, the time when you could pay someone £50 a week to labour and call them an apprentice is long gone.

    Your choice is to join the apprentice scheme and do it properly or it’s minimum wage for their age group.

    There are other schemes where you can get support, but the only one’s I’ve seen are for graduates.

    z1ppy
    Full Member

    Minimum wage is normal, though finding a good one seems to be the trick. Seemingly kids are expecting something for nothing nowadays, and having worked with my chippy m8 (fractured his elbow) fitting some kitchens lately, it’s a very boring job (help lifting, fitting easy parts, sweeping up and lots of watching or just holding). I wouldn’t want to do it long or would expect more than min wage to keep doing it for long, no matter how little I/there actually doing.

    You could also try contacting the local college for recruit or even ppl retraining, though don’t expect to keep them long on minimum wage.. but you can alway keep going back to the local college for more!

    Blazin-saddles
    Free Member

    Thanks for the scum comment! Nice.

    As I said in the OP, I have no intention of hiring someone on the pretence on an apprenticeship if they’re just labour, would pay min wage at least.

    I view apprenticeship as two way street as I’m investing my time and skill teaching them, I don’t want to do that for a kid that just wants to earn some cash to get pissed and isn’t interested. Tricky to weed out someone that wants to learn though and accepts it’ll cost them a bit in wages.

    It’s either an apprenticeship OR a labourer, you’ve got to start at he bottom either way though, like I had to and no one was paying me a minimum wage 20 years ago.

    I agree with Zippy though, it is fairly boring work generally as like you say, there’s a whole lot of waiting around for the action to happen. Also I’m not sure there is even such a thing as apprentice kitchen fitter. Joiners, yes. builders, yes. plumbers yes. Tilers, yes but combine the lot and I’m struggling.

    steve_b77
    Free Member

    Offer an internship, free labour

    duckman
    Full Member

    If you have any mates who play rugby,footy or are involved in local youth groups,ask them if they know of anybody that would suit. A clear understanding of where he/she stands,eg trail period; and then on the job training,with the understanding that they can do relative qualifications at some point.

    Blazin-saddles
    Free Member

    I don’t unfortunately, I’m a loner bike rider and all my mates are too so struggling on this front, might be an excuse to spend more time in the pub!

    br
    Free Member

    It’s either an apprenticeship OR a labourer, you’ve got to start at he bottom either way though, like I had to and no one was paying me a minimum wage 20 years ago.

    Yes, but tbh the apprentice wages (£2.73 ph) currently are probably not a lot different to the wages you got 20 years ago…

    FWIW I earned more at 19 y/o than my 19 y/o apprentice son is earning now.

    wrecker
    Free Member

    Thanks for the scum comment! Nice.

    I wasn’t calling you scum, I was saying that those who take advantage of young people are scum and going by your comment;

    As I said in the OP, I have no intention of hiring someone on the pretence on an apprenticeship if they’re just labour, would pay min wage at least.

    Obviously you’re not.

    you’ve got to start at he bottom either way though, like I had to and no one was paying me a minimum wage 20 years ago.

    Times have changed!!!

    choppersquad
    Free Member

    If I had my time again I’d certainly work for minimum wage to learn a trade. The problem comes that you could only do this if you’re still living at home (chances are an 18 yr old will be) and also that at some point he/she will bugger off to work for his/herself. By that time, if you’ve both got what you wanted out of the arrangement then everything’s great. Pay as much as think the position’s worth.

    26 years ago, I started my apprenticeship on £35/week. For overtime I got £1.50/hour

    nick1962
    Free Member

    Contact your local jobcentre and say you have a vacancy, tell them what you want and expect and ask them for guidance on salary for what you’re after in the locality.They can assist with applications, sifting, interviewing venue etc and can also advise on all the relevant training/support/incentives you and/or your employee may need.
    We all pay for these services out of our taxes so why not use them?
    https://www.gov.uk/jobcentre-plus-help-for-recruiters/overview

    seosamh77
    Free Member

    edhornby – Member
    The living wage = £7.85 per hour

    yip pay this atleast, you aren’t talking about training someone up, you’re just looking for a skivvy to do the heavy lifting.

    I know this, cause I used to do the same thing for my da with I was at school and going through college. he used to give me 40/50 quid a shift in the mid to late 90s.

    footflaps
    Full Member

    26 years ago, I started my apprenticeship on £35/week. For overtime I got £1.50/hour

    26 years ago I was earning £3.50 an hour pot scrubbing in a Cambridge College after 6th form every evening! Spent most of it on drugs and loose women and squandered the rest 😉

    br
    Free Member

    26 years ago, I started my apprenticeship on £35/week. For overtime I got £1.50/hour

    Where, the Sudan?

    fr0sty125
    Free Member

    If it was me I would be paying at least the 21+ minimum wage. I pay my cleaner £10 an hour.

    benp1
    Full Member

    I’m presuming you’re putting it through your books, in which case you have to pay minimum wage. You’ll have employers NI to pay on top of that

    If you have money spare at the end of the job you can offer that up as an incentive to work a bit harder

    BoardinBob
    Full Member

    I remember working as a labourer for a roofing company and getting the grand total of £40 a week for 5 days of 9-5. Never even thought to question it at the time and it was only 15 years ago!

    gofasterstripes
    Free Member

    Quick pointer:
    Basic manual handling training should be given. Bad backs are endemic.
    Same for any Work at Height, and safety footwear etc.

    I know nothing about the legal side of all this but I think you should check these out.

    marcus
    Free Member

    Sounds like you need someone who’s self employed and can be paid in cash as and when you need them. 😉

    russ295
    Free Member

    im in the same boat, fit kitchens as my bread earner.

    when i first went self employed, about 12 years ago my Dad who was close to retirement gave me a hand for a number of years.

    got him out of the house/pub and he enjoys pottering.

    age has caught up with him and ive struggled to get some one half as good.
    nearly every young lad ive tried is keen as mustard for a couple of weeks then their interest drops and they spend more time on their phone or complaining they are knackered. (usualy after getting home at 3am)

    if its only for helping out now and then i look for older people these days.

    footflaps – Member
    26 years ago, I started my apprenticeship on £35/week. For overtime I got £1.50/hour
    26 years ago I was earning £3.50 an hour pot scrubbing in a Cambridge College after 6th form every evening! Spent most of it on drugs and loose women and squandered the rest

    b r – Member
    26 years ago, I started my apprenticeship on £35/week. For overtime I got £1.50/hour

    The only way to do an electrical apprenticeship was through the YTS believe it or not

    Where, the Sudan?

    chiefgrooveguru
    Full Member

    Get in touch with local colleges who run courses in your field and talk to then about apprenticeships. It is well worth it – you’ll get candidates who are in it for the long run and training them up won’t be such a financial drain on your business. You can pay an apprentice what you like as long as it’s above the minimum so you have a lot of flexibility for rewarding them as they gain skills. And by the time the apprenticeship is over they’ll be skilled enough give you a decent return on paying them a proper wage.

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