Hi,
i’ve had a brain wave of crabon fibre. I have a rather hefty camping stove (the kind with a remote canister) that i want to lighten up. My plan is to replace the base plate and legs with a lighter material. I first thought Ti would be great (which it will) but difficult to work with when cutting/shaping.
Next thoguht was carbon, but i don’t know how it would handle the heat from the stove.
I’ve never seen a carbon camping stove before, is there a perfectly good reason for this?
Ta

Probably because aluminium would do the job just as well and would be mucho cheaper.
Carbon is very strong (if done properly) for a given weight, but you don’t really need strength, just low weight. So I’d go with a suitable thickness aluminium with some holes drilled in it to reduce the weight further.
That said, the resin used to bond the carbon will melt if heated enough but if you can hold the existing base plate with your fingers while the stove has been on for a bit then carbon would probably be OK.

You know that black stuff you burn on fires, because it burns really well? Charcoal? That’s carbon 🙂 If you’ve never seen a carbon camping stove, that’s probably because it’s not worth it.

Having said that, what bit are you talking about? It doesn’t get particularly hot underneath a stove..

You know those red hot glowing brake discs on an F1 car? They’re a carbon ceramic composite – thus the ability to withstand heat depends entirely on the exact composite.

You need to make the gas canister out of CF to be proper bling though.

Carbon cermaic composite. Not carbon fibre is it?

It’s a carbon fibre reinforced composite. Show me a bike with a frame that’s just made of carbon fibre and I’ll eat my hat.

‘those red hot glowing brake discs on an F1 car?’

I’ll bet the friction material isn’t carbon, and any carbon fibre lasts microseconds at the working surface. Otherwise, well have you heard of graphite as a high-temperature lubricant?

Saying ‘composite’ doesn’t tell you anything about what it’s made of.

Carbon fibre usually means fibres and a sort of resin. Adding ceramic to the mix is a different ballgame isn’t it? Try heating your carbon road bike frame to get it to glow orange hot, see what happens.

That’s my point, it depends entirely on the matrix material. If you can keep the carbon fibres separated from any oxygen so they don’t catch fire, then they will withstand much higher temperatures before failure than almost any metal. Obviously the epoxy resin matrices in CFRP won’t go that hot before melting/burning.

Talking about ‘carbon-fibre’ as being one single material with one set of characteristics is even more ill-informed than treating all steels or aluminimum alloys as one material.

Clearly, CGG – however I don’t think the OP is going to be able to engineer a composite tuned for his purposes. If he gets anything it’d be cut out of some other broken thing.

Alu is still your best bet.

The epoxy resin will be a problem – depending on what resin is used it may be useful up to 180degC in a non-structural situation but not much more and tbh I would aim for a LOT less. A composite made with a phenolic resin will be more heat resistant.

Not sure which part of the oven you want to make but you can test temperatures by getting some stick on temperature things (single use that record the max temp) and see how hot the bits get in use.

tbh I probably wouldn’t bother though – but you could always paint the ‘hot side’ in aluminium paint to reflect any IR radiation if the carbon is not in contact with the heat source directly.

Brakes are normally carbon-carbon and has very little similarity to a plastic resin (eg epoxy, phenolic, polyester) reinforced with carbon, glass and/or kevlar fibres.

Carbon in the form of graphite can withstand huge temps and maintain structural properties – eg it’s the core of a nuclear reactor and is used in space applications and car brakes. The resins used in composites are normally thermoset plastics so don’t melt – they will lose stiffness at elevated temp but then burn/sublime.

As stated above, I’d just go with Aluminium. Cheap(ish), easy to work with, just as light as carbon would be (as you don’t need the strength) and no issues with heat.

Thanks for the helpfull replies and the not so helpfull sarcastic reply (diamond is also pure carbon and doesn’t burn well).

This is the stove, it’s the plate just underneath the burner and the 3 legs i’m wanting to replace. Currently it’s quite thick 2mm steel plate.
Would be good to lose some weight, but i’m also doing it because i just like mess around and modify things.

Will be easier and cheaper to get a new one.

Looking at it, Alu might get too hot, so perhaps Ti.

You’ll save grammes. Maybe 5 or 6. Go for it 😀

In reality, the carbon fibre you can get hold of will cope with about 70-80 degrees before the matrix material starts to break down and it becomes a soggy mess. Not worth the effort.

Apologies

This aging, balding ex-techie is out of date once again…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforced_carbon-carbon

The world does keep changing when you stop looking, and I still can’t remember what it was we used graphite lube for, under high-temp conditions.

Having seen the stove in question I’d say def not for the legs and probably not for the base.
For some reason I thought it was a bigger stove – why would you need to reduce the weight of that 😕 I suppose you could drill some lightening holes in the base if you’re bored.

Would you not save more weight by replacing that braided hose with a suitable rubber one?

Would you not save more weight by replacing that braided hose with a suitable rubber one?

or just having a good sneeze before you set out?

You can save a bit of weight if you use drillium.

That steel base plate could be much lighter with a few strategically placed holes. Cost nought to do, and less hassle than manufacturing a new one.

Could you shorten or get a lighter hose?

Would you not save more weight by replacing that braided hose with a suitable rubber one?

I think there may only be one diameter hose that fits and it’s the same whether it’s braided or not so doubt there’s much weight to be saved there. Also a braided hose is not a bad idea were it’s in close proximity to the burner/subjected to frequent abraison.
I dont think the designer would be very pleased if you told him that stove was heavy….. design looks pretty good to me.
wishiwascalledsteve – you are bored aren’t you 🙂

Learn to strike a flint and gather firewood when you set up camp. A small flint and steel weigh bugger all. A knife comes in handy to shave kindling.

Ferrari and Mclaren wanted to build their exhaust systems out of this stuff this year but weren’t allowed. Betting it’s not cheap.

I’m assuming he wants lightweight kit for Polaris style adventure racing. Going Ray Mears on things probably wont’ help.

There are way way lighter stoves round for these purposes.

Don’t cook stuff and just eat cheese.

Thanks for the helpfull replies and the not so helpfull sarcastic reply (diamond is also pure carbon and doesn’t burn well).

Diamond burns quite well actually, if you get it going. It’s also metastable on carbon’s phase diagram 😛

All those diamonds are slowly turning to graphite before your eyes!

It’s also impossible to touch diamond.

Thanks again for the replies, initially the plan was to just dremel the current steel plate and legs.
Then thought Ti or carbon would be even better.
It’s my backpacking/bivi stove so less weight is better, but if i’m honest i’m wanting to do it just because i enjoy messing around with things.
Currently weighs 212g without the canister, replaced a pocket rocket at 90g and want to get it closer to the pocket rocket.
It’s partnered with an Alpkit Ti mug for lightweight cooking.

erm yeah forget carbon for that. Just get handy with the tools or buy a Ti one.

Pocket rockets are fairly unstable to cook with mind as is any stove perched on a cannister.

I’ve got one that looks like this:

Although no idea what brand it is. Looks like a badged no-name thing but it works really well and is much smaller and lighter than an MSR pocket rocket.

Here’s a link to a similar one that you can actually buy:

http://www.hike-lite.co.uk/Other/Stoves/Crux+Gas+Stove.html