Seeing the story on the news about the North Sea helicopter down. I used to do some work for the drilling company, gosh, I am so glad I don’t do that any more

🙁

A Super Puma as well. That’s a good ship.

Sad news.

Isnt the super puma the same type that went down a month or so ago?

did you know that a different soldier gets a limb amputated every week in Selly Oak Birmingham and that there are currently approximately 1000 severely injured soldiers in the medical system in the Uk after being shot/blown up in Iraq/Afghanistan. Perspective please.

ski, yes I do know that, I have no desire to denegrate the seriousness of that issue, but it is irrelevant to this thread. Start another if you wish.

yes, it ditched and everyone survived. Just off a rig IIRC so the standby vessel picked everyone up. This one looks like it crashed.
IIRC Super Pumas carry most of the traffic to/fro the rigs.

Soldiers are being paid to risk being shot/blown up, oil rig workers arent paid to be dropped in the sea?

The sad plight of a large number of soldiers doesnt negate the plight of 16 people who work for an oil company.

Some sense please.

Do you know why those soldiers were being shot at/blown up in Irag and Afghanistan? I don’t. Do you know how it affect you and me if they left those countries and came home?

Do you know why those men were flying out the oil rig? It was to get the material to produce the petrol for your car and the electricity you’re burning by reading this. Do you know what the effect would be if they didn’t do that? There’s still oil and gas, but there would be a lot less of it.

I do believe I have a sense of perspective.
I don’t read the Daily Mail

sorry for going off on one, it’s just that most people don’t know what goes on in their own country. Regarding soldiers being ‘paid’ for that sort of thing, that’s a very naive assumption. Although I agree that most soldiers join for adventure and travel, they are paid very poorly compared to these ‘poor’ rig workers, who accept the risk against their considerable wages, whose life is merely inconvenienced by separation from families and ‘poor’ living conditions rather than in daily danger.

So it is okay for 16 people to be killed on say a bus into work tomorrow ?

this is nothing to do with the daily mail. i am a serving soldier who has been to the first gulf war, kosovo, bosnia, iraq, and afghanistan over 20 years. maybe i’m getting a bit bitter that it is in fact about petrol, and I’m fed up with people dying for it. sorry.

Very sad – one of the dead is my little brother’s childhood friend. I met him by chance in Under the Hammer in Aberdeen a few days before my wedding last year. He still seemed like a kid to me (indeed he was still a young lad). Just wonder how it would feel to think of your son’s body floating about in the North Sea somewhere.

Ski, you know the soldiers, I know many who fly to and from work just like those who lost their lives today. Aberdeen is a very small place so some mutual respect would be appreciated.

Perspective please.

I was listening to this as I drove home this afternoon and it struck me that we are utterly obsessed with death and dying yet it’s something that happens all the time and whilst always unwelcome and certainly premature in this, case totally natural. Yet we report it, are fascinated by it and debate who’s fault it might have been endlessly. I don’t buy the arguement about ‘preventable deaths’ because all that does is neatly slot into the downward cycle that means that eventually we won’t be able to do anything without a risk assessment.

Of course this doesn’t detract at all from the devestation this must have caused the families, friends and collegues of those who’ve died, but I can’t help wondering, what has this to do with me other than reminding me of my own mortality, and does it help me live my life, be a better person and father to be constantly reminded of this? I don’t think it does really.

Ski, why you are trying to devalue the lives of oil workers I’ve no idea, the loss of solders in the middle east is equally tragic as oil workers falling into the sea. I have several friends in the industry and we lost 7 guys in Morecambe bay 3 years ago.

If you feel they are overpaid for what they do thats a different discussion, at the end of the day they are probably just young guys who happened to make a different career choice than you.

Nick we should do everything to stop preventable deaths (or do you want your kids stuck up chimneys again). I do not believe in doing everything without a risk assessment but I do believe in doing a risk assessment in the workplace. And BTW I work in the oil industry

I am not trying to de-value anything, and I feel immensely for the families of those who have lost loved ones, I just know that there are lots of people dying and being badly disabled for a cause which is based on a web of lies (the Iraq and Afghan wars). Maybe I should have started a thread of my own instead of jumping in on this one.

Nick – of course we’re obsessed by death – it’s one of the only certainties in life (to trot out an old cliche). It’s the one thing we all have in common.

To an extent, I agree with you – we face the news of others’ deaths constantly. If you watched Screenwash tonight, you’ll have heard an excellent portrayal of the way a lot of sensible folk felt about the death of Jane Goodie: slightly confused but mostly indifferent – it just washes over you doesn’t it?

It only hits home when it’s someone you know, or have a huge respect for. The preoccupation with the deaths of strangers (even including the Darwin Awards!!) is a natural part of being human.

ski – leave the army

Well I’m not sure how relevant it is but at around 19:00 a Sea King landed at ARI (possibly unrelated though) and it wasn’t exactly hanging about so hopefully there have been some survivors but the signs aren’t good.

ski your point has some validity, however those of us who work in the industry and have flown in this sort of chopper have a little more personal involvement.

I would have thought that as a serving soldier you would expect that a byproduct of that role, and they must tell you this, is that you had a greater than 0 chance of being posted to a dangerous place where people may wish to kill you.
Whereas if you work on a rig (or seismic boats as I did) then you would not have that expectation.
Therefore they are different.

But anyway, sad news, having spent a lot of time flying around in ‘copters in the north sea it scared me so much i left the industry. Just normal people doing normal jobs with a more dangerous than normal commute.

GW, thanks. I am doing that, soon. I have started to ‘re-settle’ and feel an enormous rush of relief when thinking of my release date. My point about pointless deaths however still stands and there needs to be more public awareness about the full extent of the price paid by the nation.

there needs to be more public awareness about the full extent of the price paid by the nation.

Don’t we hear about it everyday ?

About 2 construction workers die every week in the UK from injuries received in building site accidents. In 2006/07 32% of all workplace deaths were in the construction industry. Hundreds more are injured every week.

And on top of that, every year thousands of building workers die from the asbestos related diseases asbestosis, lung cancer and mesothelioma.

There needs to be more public awareness about the full extent of the price paid by the nation for the construction of their homes, schools, hospitals etc.

Perspective please.

Few of my mates work offshore- so its a bit of a nerve tingler when you gvet news like that, SKI2484 resspect to you and your pals and stay safe!
And grizzly’s right, more casualitys from “silent ” killers than owt else.
Stay safe people
G

Although I agree that most soldiers join for adventure and travel, they are paid very poorly compared to these ‘poor’ rig workers, who accept the risk against their considerable wages, whose life is merely inconvenienced by separation from families and ‘poor’ living conditions rather than in daily danger.

Not naive at all mate… While the rig workers may be well paid, they DO risk their lives daily (rig explosions, heavy and dangerous work, accepting the commute to work has a very high likelyhood of killing them). Soldiers get paid fairly well (nowhere near what rig workers do) but they also get a LOT of perks, the travel, the adventure, accomodation, if they’re lucky enough to be soldiers when we aren’t stretched to breaking point across 5 war zones they spend a lot of time only training. In actual vast numbers of soldiers do not spend their days on the front line. Either way, what they are paid is utterly irrelevent – they have both selected that job. No-one forced them into it, one knew they risked death at the hands of the sea and a rig, the other knew they risked death at the hands of the enemy, one is not “better” or more deserving than the other, your calls for perspective suggest you think the rig workers are less deserving simply because a greater number are killed in another job. Quite frankly I find people who pop up and effectively say “stop whinging about a few dying, theres more elsewhere” have very strange values and reasons for posting.

Death is emotive at anytime however having done 22 yrs in the Army and now working in the oil industry the two are very much alike, they are close knit communities and even here in Nigeria someone will arrive down at Breakfast who knows someone who went down on that Puma, some guys will have to get on a chopper and fly out to a platform this AM, but life goes on in both the Forces and the industry but everyone thinks about what could be and has a quiet moment for the ones that dont get back. RIP

not another one. Best i get texting ive three mates on the rigs. On the subject of death etc all human life is important they all have family and friends. I lost a good friend yesterday from the fire service in a non work related accident. And ive served twelve years in the army and seven in the fire service so far and seen enough crap to realise all life is precious

This is all rather disappointing verging on disgusting. 🙁
I’m finding it hard to believe the way this thread has gone.

From now on I guess we should no longer show any sorrow for anyone who dies unless they are soldiers. Next time I cut a dead person out of a car accident I will be sure to tell their family to have some perspective. Get a grip!

I can’t help but notice that we seem to have far more accidents in the UK sector than they do in the Norwegian sector. I started off working offshore on UK rigs and then switched to Norwegian rigs. I can’t say anything about the safety of the helicopters but as far as safety and general working conditions on the rigs themselves go, the UK sector isn’t even comparable to Norway.

Also, when I was flying out to Norwegian rigs we always had a locator beacon attached to our suits. This was tried in the UK sector but apparently they interfered with aircraft systems so they weren’t used. I’d hate to think that anyone could have survived this if they had been wearing a locator beacon. On some of the UK rigs you can actually see Norwegian rigs so I think the UK needs to take a long hard look at itself and ask why we are prepared to put up with conditions that are so inferior compared to our next door neighbours.

I agree with Barney-McGrew.

It’s always sad and disturbing when people die in any industry. Thoughs go out to oil workers, my bro is up in Aberdeen in the industry so close to home.

Barney_McGrew….spot on!

If anyone wants to talk about perspective, i spent last night with guys who were first on the scene of the crash. A far more informed and dignified point of view than some of the drivel spouted here.

BruceWee…it’s obviously a long time since you have worked in the UK then.
Living conditions on the Noggie rigs may be better, but there safety performance is worse than the UKCS.
I work for a Norwegian company btw.

my missus was supposed to be going out next week

but her work uses that company so theyve put it on hold for a while!

It’s not that long since I worked in the UK sector, about a year and a half. I don’t know where to find statistics for safety performance but just from my own personal experience I’ve been exposed to far more dangerous situations in the UK than I ever have in Norway. What I found was that the UK sector is more interested in hiding safety issues and covering up or spinning accidents so that management can get their safety performance bonuses. Norway has more of a no-blame culture which encourages people to report unsafe practices.

As a QHSE Advisor…i’d say thats debatable!!!

Mind if I ask if you’re rig based or town based?

BruceWee – I’m shorebased now, having spent the best part of 10 years on the rigs.

It is disappointing that every thread on here has to turn into an argument.

Saying that, my thoughts and condolences go to all those affected. And even if i wasnt involved in the industry (a rig-based tiffy, Central North Sea), this would still be the case.

Soldiers, as much as it may not be their wont, are in the business of war, with consequences they have accepted, and as much as anyone involved in regular air travel does the same, they are civilian passengers, on a chartered, business-run service. 16 civilian casualties in one incident, in any walk of life, is horrendous.

(Not belittling anyone in the forces, they do a fantastic job, but my contract had nothing about being deployed in warzones.)

Futureboy77, fair enough. I’m just a bit surprised since you’re the first person I’ve come across who has worked on rigs in both sectors who says that the UK is actually safer rather than just appearing safer on paper.