Just noticed that the bottom headset cup in my bike has rotated about 1/8 of a turn from where it was installed. The bike is a new carbon frame and it’s a new hope headset installed by my lbs. I only noticed when the logo looked a bit off centre and looking back at the pictures I took before riding it it’s definitely rotated.
I’m going to take it into the shop in the morning and see what they say but I have never seen this before. Should I be concerned?

Cheers.
Andy

I’ve heard of it happening on some carbon frames. And, being able to push the cups in with your hand etc… All i know, is if it was my bike, i wouldn’t be having it.

Yes, be worried. It’s not a proper fit and over time it will fret in the frame and get worse.

See if you can turn it by hand. If you can I’d be going back to the shop and seeking their opinion.
Only time I’ve had a headset cup move easily (i.e. it practically fell out of the frame) was when there was a nice crack at the top front of the headtube.

Andy, is the frame a Nomad mk3? Interestingly I had the same issue with the Hope lower cup on my Nomad mk3 – it rotated by around 10mm. I removed it (cup felt tight to remove) and installed another Hope lower cup and it has rotated by around 2mm. I contacted SC warranty about this issue and they are sending out a new Cane Creek headset to try.

Is it bronson of nature?

No thanks. Either the frame is knackered, or it will knacker the frame. Definitely not worth messing about with. I cant think of much worse than a head tube coming off at speed.

If the frame turns out to be solid, but i couldn’t get it fixed under warranty, i would re fit it with lashings of an appropriate epoxy.
I heard the Audi R8 is possibly made of araldite 😉 (bits of it at least)

Might be the extreme end of tolerances so if the headset is +/-0.1mm and the frame is the same. The frame is +0.1mm in diameter and the headset is -0.1mm
then it’ll be 2mm out which is enough to for it to move.

They are obvisouly extremes and I would hope they would have smaller tolerances such as 0.25mm

No point trying it send it back.

We had a prototype lotus elise 4×4 in last year that was glued together so glue is strong stuff.

It’s a new nomad frame and it’s about 3 weeks old. I’m going to take it to the shop in the morning and see what they say. I’m really surprised it can happen knowing how much force I have had to use to get them in in to aluminium frames in the past. Glad I left this one up to the shop so it’s not on my head.

I’d be allover this like a cheap suit and I wouldnt accept ‘loctite’ as a word uttered to me. If you hear that word call jungle. Doubt they would though. Tbh give jungle a call Ive found them very helpful in the past on a quick question.

It’s not right, but it’s not that unusual either, i’ve seen quite a few carbon frames with headsets and BB shells that have gone baggy.

Well I took it back to the shop earlier and they were as surprised as I am. They removed the cup which required hammering out as normal i.e it wasn’t loose enough to pull out by hand and we measured the frame and headset and compared against the hope headset guide. They both measured very close to what the should be and the headset was larger than the opening in the frame. They put a new cup in anyway but it’s done it again this afternoon after 1 ride.
My mate noticed his has done it on his carbon nomad which is the previous model.
I’ll pop back Monday and see what they say

Andy

Well I took it back to the shop earlier and they were as surprised as I am. They removed the cup which required hammering out as normal i.e it wasn’t loose enough to pull out by hand and we measured the frame and headset and compared against the hope headset guide. They both measured very close to what the should be and the headset was larger than the opening in the frame. They put a new cup in anyway but it’s done it again this afternoon after 1 ride.
My mate noticed his has done it on his carbon nomad which is the previous model.
I’ll pop back Monday and see what they say
Andy

Andy I’ve had some experience of this in the past.

Many years ago a had a frame where the lower headset cup moved in the frame producing a horrible cracking noise.

Ever since that I always fit headsets with a deep cup insertions and it seems to have solved the problem.

I currently have a MK3 Nomad and fitted a Chris king. The cup presses in the frame a lot further than hope cups.

Ever since that I always fit headsets with a deep cup insertions and it seems to have solved the problem.

Or, it should be right in the first place.

OP be firm. You’ve paid top ££ for it afterall

I’ll see what they say. They are a very good shop so I should be ok.
The longer cups would likely sort it but I prefer hope headsets to Chris king so I’ll try and get it sorted using what I have.
What baffles me is what is making it turn? I could understand if the cups were very loose and the bearings ceased but everything is new and rotating freely.
Thanks for all the advice.

Andy

When its happened in an alu frame the shop said king was slightly bigger diameter(?)

Or they said use loctite..

I popped back into the shop earlier and they rang jungle. Jungle are going to swap the front end for a new one. I can carry on riding mine until the new one comes and the shop will swap all the bits over

Can’t ask for better after sales than that.

Andy

Just an update on this.
I haven’t had my replacement front end yet but was told to keep riding the bike until it arrived. I have done around 200 miles on it and its getting noticeably worse every ride.
Its gone from just rotating, to a slight creak, to louder creaking and now its very noisy and if I grab the cup and rock the bike you can feel it move.

So if you experience similar I recommend sorting it sooner rather than later.

Andy

I’m not sure that I’d be riding it with the amount of noise that you’re describing. I’d be back to the LBS for their opinion and asking for a loaner

OP do you ride loops in clockwise rather than anti direction or vice versa?

Thanks for the update- its good to know. Closely check the edges alround the headtube before and after each ride!

Stop riding it. Seriously. I have had a snapped steerer whilst on skyline descent at afan, I was lucky to walk away from it mostly intact. A headset / head tube type failure is going to be pretty catastrophic if you are using the bike for what it is meant for. However, if you are just posing around on fire roads then it should be fine.

What damage are you doing to the forks by continuing to ride it?

A lot of the miles I have done have been on DH tracks and jumping so it hasn’t had an easy (short) life. I don’t think I will be using it any more though until its sorted.
Hopefully it shouldn’t of damaged the forks because they are still rotating as normal on the headset bearings but let me know if you think otherwise.

Andy

My steerer failure was caused by a collapsed bearing (second hand bike, I knew I had some knocking for a few rides and was trying to work out what I was when the steerer snapped). Was new to proper mountain biking so scary lesson learnt….

If the bearing headset is tight on the steerer they should be fine, as it sounds like it is the frame / cup interface that is wearing. I’d drop the forks out and see if you can see any unusual wear or scoring to the steerer, hopefully there won’t be

I have the same issue, headset lower cup rotating in frame, on a carbon bronson. Jungle advised supplier to swap my hope headset for Crane Creek which they did but it now rotates more. Jungle then offered to swap the front triangle but the replacement has yet to materialise.

Did jungle replace your frame andysredmini and was the new one ok?

Watching this for interest…