think/hope he got ittootall - what explanation? I did not see one
WHHHOOOOOOSSSHHHHHH
as far as I can see Tootall you havent said anything yet, now maybe I am really stupid so would you do the decent thing and let me (and I believe TJ) in on what it is your trying to express.
Now, who would you believe when it comes to the analysis/collation of figures such as unemployment rates, a "Head of Macro Economic Research" or a "Medical Professional"?
Staggering sometimes, isn't it?
TooTall - MemberShould read "Incompetant head teachers recycle incompet A nt teachers"
Let me correct that for you, as it should not read that at all:
Should read "Incompetent head teachers recycle incompetent teachers"
I really hope you get it now. You do get it now, don't you?
HTH
Does anyone actually have a problem with sacking of lazy workers? I sure don't. Regardless of the report content and whether they intend to act on it, I'd hope that anyone not pulling their weight were sacked rather than allowed to linger on being worse than not present.
right, so the point can still stand but I spelt a word wrong? Glad you wasted so much time on it.
Ta clubber 
coffeeking - MemberDoes anyone actually have a problem with sacking of lazy workers? I sure don't. Regardless of the report content and whether they intend to act on it, I'd hope that anyone not pulling their weight were sacked rather than allowed to linger on being worse than not present.
Nope - so long as it is done fairly
Does anyone actually know anything about Free Schools and Academies and getting rid of crap teachers? Are there different rules, I know I worked at an Academy myself so should know, but well it never came up.
coffeeking +1
Should lazy workers not pulling their own weight be allowed to cling to a job ....or should they be sacked. Discuss.
Does anyone actually have a problem with sacking of lazy workers? I sure don't. Regardless of the report content and whether they intend to act on it, I'd hope that anyone not pulling their weight were sacked rather than allowed to linger on being worse than not present.
No, but they can already be dealt with currently by any competent manager/hr department.
Does anyone actually know anything about Free Schools and Academies and getting rid of crap teachers?
As I understand it the teachers in a free school or Academy are employed by the school itself and answerable to the headteacher and the governors. In a regular comprehensive they are employed by the LEA. LEAs havent been exactly rigorous in their HR policies which is why so few bad teachers have been properly held to account.
right, so the point can still stand but I spelt a word wrong? Glad you wasted so much time on it.
You are a teacher aren't you?
You are a teacher aren't you?
Yes, whats your point caller?
Mcboo, so that means there's no difference at all doesnt it, I mean in reality? Head teachers and governors do the hiring and firing at normal schools, LEA's just hold the purse strings. Sounds to me like another one of Gove's new powers for teachers to disipline kids thing that was arriving in September. I for one have not been given any new powers, I was hoping for a cattle prod. I bet academies and free schools have to go thru' the competancy procedure the same as a normal school.
heres some more spelling and grammar to correct Tootall
TandemJeremy - Member
MSP - qualifying period for tribunals went from 2 yrs to one in the late 90s.
However our employment legislation offers us much much less protection that the rest of europe - hence when one multinational wanted to close a plant they closed the british one a it was much cheaper to close than the German one
Exactly that has been my gripe for years and was hoping this would include employees the same writes
here.
But the Torys ruled this one out then.
Does anyone actually have a problem with sacking of lazy workers? I sure don't. Regardless of the report content and whether they intend to act on it, I'd hope that anyone not pulling their weight were sacked rather than allowed to linger on being worse than not present.
Theres such things in place already, just blame your managers not sorting it out.
The more you allow the harder you will be able to take such actions.
Mcboo, so that means there's no difference at all doesnt it, I mean in reality? Head teachers and governors do the hiring and firing at normal schools, LEA's just hold the purse strings
On the face of it yes, what's the difference? LEAs (and here we do get into a bit of conjecture) are generally staffed by professional educationalists, so by their nature tend to take a more indulgent view towards teaching standards. If you believe the reformers the single biggest obstacle to driving up standards in schools is driving up standards of teaching. That means applying pressure to failing staff and I'm afraid pushing out those who shouldnt be in the classroom. LEAs just havent been fulfilling that side of the bargain......18 teachers sacked for failure in 40 years tells it's own story.
In Germany for example, the largely static workforce means that you don't get this cross polination of ideas and therefore you don't get radical innovation.
Good points but some of the reasons the Germans don't travel is the pay is very good
and working conditions are excellent.
In Germany for example, the largely static workforce means that you don't get this cross polination of ideas and therefore you don't get radical innovation.
Yet they seem to patent so many more ideas than the UK, if I were a more sceptical person, I might think that statement was just made up nonsense.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_patents#Top_10_countries_in_2007
Think your forgotten we don't manufacture much here now
and the working class workforce now stack shelves at Tesco and work in MCDonalds
and other such fast food places, serving waste busting food or call centres.
18 teachers sacked for failure in 40 years tells it's own story
honest question and I dont know the answer but are you getting confused by the numbers being stopped from teaching rather than sacked. As said most will go well before they are pushed.
grantway - MemberThink your forgotten we don't manufacture much here now
Myth... Mostly perpetuated by looking at manufacturing as a % of GDP, or as % of employment, rather than looking at it in isolation. Obviously if other industries grow faster, that causes the % of GDP to fall... And as mechanisation increases, numbers of people employed fall. Neither means that manufacturing is falling.
But if you look at it in terms of production and in terms of value, manufacturing was at a record high in 2007, and has grown steadily in the last 50 years. In 2006, we were the 6th biggest manufacturer in the world, graded by value of output.
something a little more up to date:
What such figures don't show is where all the money actually goes. A lot of it ends up in offshore bank accounts, and a lot of tax isn't paid...
The UK is slipping downwards and will continue to do so. It's at the end of it's period of economic dominance and will be soon be overtaken by emerging economic powers like Brazil and India.
The UK was responsible for 2.6 per cent of world manufacturing output, down from 5.5 per cent in 1980.
That's less than half what it was 30 years ago. And I don't really see much chance of that slide being reversed, tbh...
honest question and I dont know the answer but are you getting confused by the numbers being stopped from teaching rather than sacked. As said most will go well before they are pushed.
Sure, but thats true of any line of work, people get a quiet tap on the shoulder and off they quietly go. But it can't be particularly the case with state teaching.....can it?
Yet they seem to patent so many more ideas than the UK, if I were a more sceptical person, I might think that statement was just made up nonsense.
It's actually a statement based on patent data, rather ironically. If you study the patent data over the last 20 years, as I rather sadly, have done, you'll find that the US and UK registered companies tend to file patents covering radical innovation, i.e. new inventions, whereas German companies tend to file patents focused on process refinement.
I can point you in the direction of the literature if you like? Have a look at 'Divergent Capitalisms; The Social Structuring and Change of Business Systems' Whitley 1998.
Sure, but thats true of any line of work, people get a quiet tap on the shoulder and off they quietly go. But it can't be particularly the case with state teaching.....can it?
depends if they have not been Tupe over to a private sector
where you keep your terms and conditions up to One year
and you will loose your years service after that too.
Myth...
Would you all like to know another myth?
The world is no more globalised now, relatively speaking, than it was at the turn of the 19th Century.
This is based on the percentages of GDP generated by foreign trade, for the developed nations at the time. That level is fractionally higher now than it was before, but not significantly.
Globalisation is real, but it's been real for the last 100 years or so.
But it can't be particularly the case with state teaching.....can it?
Oh yes, happens all the time. It involves being monitored all the time, having books checked all the time. I will freely admit I dont do what my school says is the minimum of marking, apart from anything else it would take me about 20 hrs a week. No one ever seems to get too bothered by it though. If your a rubbish teacher these things are checked regularly.
What such figures don't show is where all the money actually goes. A lot of it ends up in offshore bank accounts, and a lot of tax isn't paid...
The UK is slipping downwards and will continue to do so. It's at the end of it's period of economic dominance and will be soon be overtaken by emerging economic powers like Brazil and India.
The UK was responsible for 2.6 per cent of world manufacturing output, down from 5.5 per cent in 1980.
That's less than half what it was 30 years ago. And I don't really see much chance of that slide being reversed, tbh...
Same thing with Australia I know a lot of the Kitchen/furniture makers have most if not all there
furniture made in China
most of my repetitive sized furniture is made around Manchester and
we just concentrate on making the special sized cabinets now.
Its cost affective and i am also keeping people employed within this country.
Elfinsafety - MemberThat's less than half what it was 30 years ago. And I don't really see much chance of that slide being reversed, tbh...
Oh Elfin... You know perfectly well that none of what you posted points to a reduction in UK manufacturing- only to a greater increase elsewhere. And frankly, for a country our size to be "only" the 7th biggest manufacturer in the world, is not something to be pessimistic about.
You know perfectly well that none of what you posted points to a reduction in UK manufacturing
No, but what does point to a reduction in UK manufacturing is a reduction in the number of factories and workshops and that...
And a sizeable chunk of our manufacturing output is weapons and weapon systems. Oh look we've bin involved in lots of wars in the last 20 years...
Fact is this country is declining as an economic power, and this decline will continue. Only the most stubborn of ostriches can fail to see this.
Best all start learning Chinese, then....
Thing is Northwind I here you regarding numbers
But there has been a huge reduction in Large manufacturing
including the midi sized factories or workshops that simply
get it made out of this country !
Its ok quoting numbers all day but just how much of that 7th largest manufacturing
is actually made within our waters?
Most of it is brought in made outside and sold off
I would say the North of England is around the last areas of larger manufacturing
A guy I know buys his furniture in from Italy and takes the stickers off and puts his own brand on
and has two guys touching up damaged items and then sending out.
Elfinsafety - MemberNo, but what does point to a reduction in UK manufacturing is a reduction in the number of factories and workshops and that...
<bangs head against wall> Your perception is false. Rose by .2% in the last quarter, is predicted to fall by .5% in the next, but with an overall growth of 1.5% for the year. Despite the fact that as you may have heard, there's a recession on.
If your complaint is that we're not outproducing China, then that's inevitable- but don't pretend our manufacturing sector is in decline. The world's largest countries produce more than us, shock horror.
grantway - MemberIts ok quoting numbers all day but just how much of that 7th largest manufacturingis actually made within our waters?
100% of it. That's why it's called UK manufacturing.
No, but they can already be dealt with currently by any competent manager/hr department.
That's fair enough, I'm not up on employment law, but I'm under the impression it's fairly hard to sack someone even with good grounds, hence managers jumping through hoops to prove fault etc.
<bangs head against wall>
Careful, you'll hurt youself if you keep doing that.
Your perception is false
No it's not. It's a fact that there is less manufacturing in this country than there was 30 years ago. There are significantly less factories ffs! Have you not noticed?
No point in quoting massaged engineered figures created by agencies with a vested interest in making positive noises; the truth is the UK's manufacturing base and economy is in decline, and has bin for ages.
don't pretend our manufacturing sector is in decline
You must log in to post.
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
