A precendent was set by Ramdin and ironically was judged by Chris Broad whose comments on this type of behaviour are clear and categorical. Inconsistent, hypocritical or simply racist

Wow.

As above, why do you not have the same scorn for constant appeals which clearly have no basis?

It really is a shame that hysterical bleating has taken over this thread – it’s been a superb game so far – if you’re not enjoying this then cricket probably isn’t for you.

Leaving it up the umpire to decide is not at all the same as pretending to have taken a catch – however many times you say it. 🙄

Now, Stuart Broad… sorry, but that was outright cheating,

He did not walk but the rules do not require him to
It was the Aussies who started the tradition of leaving it up to the umpire to decide so it is a bit rich – ironic – for you to claim it is cheating ?

Will you be calling Trott back for another go because if not that is just as much “cheating” as in it was the wrong decision? You will wont you? I mean you cheated by appealing for somethign that was not out etc

Broad wasn’t a rough call, he knew he was out,

Do you really think he will be the only batsmen who thinks he is out this series and does not walk – granted none of the others will be as blatant

Broad cheated

Not so sure he did tbh and if he did every person who has ever batted at any level has cheated

This was a clear misplayed cut that went straight into the slips hands.

It hits the keeper then goes to slip

But it’s important that you do play fair – you respect the opposition and you respect the umpires.

He has done that form what I can see – certainly the last part 😉

The laws do not say you are only out if the umpire gives you out.

They do actually- well they say the umpire decides actually

Will same sanction be applied here?[ dropped catch player banned]

TBH if they banned every player who appealed for something they thought was not actually out there would be very few fielders and no bowlers on the pitch- but that is not “real” cheating.

Dropping a catch and claiming you did not is worse IMHO as that is deliberately trying to deceive the umpire. Broad did not try to deliberately deceive the umpire he just made a poor call

I think he should have walked but the rules are not evenly applied

I am sure batters would if every bad call was overturned

but heaven forbid if you are a West Indian or a Pakistani. There is a word for that.

Is it straw man oh that is two so I guess it must be stupid 🙄

Grum, I do (have the same scorn) and in this case the Pakistanis are among the worst culprits IMO.

I am enjoying the game, largely, and cricket is for me as I have played it for 40 odd years from schoolboy county level to village/league cricket now. FWIW, our village cricket team dropped out of the league for the very simple reason that we got fed up with constant cheating and poor atmosphere that was become all too common in club league cricket.. We only play teams that want to play cricket in the same way that we do and we now enjoy it much more. We try to apply the laws quoted above to our mini-league. As KP and Gilchrist have both said, for different perspectives, we all take personal responsibility for our behaviour.

Broad has made his decision and so be it. I hope the match carries on its entertaining way. Then I hope that the authorities do the correct thing rather than appear “disingenuous” !!!

(p.s. I am not comparing SB to a drugs cheat, rather the arguments that justify his behaviour.)

Anyway beautiful weather outside, so I wish you all a nice ride before entertaining cricket later. Shame that Swinley STW clashes with the Test match.

I really like the notion of a team withdrawing from league cricket because of the poisonous atmosphere that can infect some leagues.

The vast majority of games I played were hard but fair, but over the years there were some really nasty ones.

I played one game where one of our lads deliberately targeted one of their players over his fairly public and well known divorce. This guy, to his credit, put up with it for a while. He then lost it and brought up the subject of our player’s dad who had died of cancer.

I was embarrassed and ashamed to be on the pitch at the time. I had tried to calm our player down a couple of times before the eventual blow-up, but no one was listening. The whole game was an endless stream of abuse, much of it personal, downright cheating and bad feeling.

That was one of the worst I can remember, but there were others.

I did let myself down a couple of times, but not outright cheating.

One incident I do regret was one later in my playing days, when I had dropped down to our seconds. I was still quick enough to do batters for pace. In that league it wasn’t unknown for the square leg umpire to be from the batting side. We had a cut and dried stumping. Miles out. The batter started to walk, but then came back. There was a ‘scene’. Anyhow, when they were nine down and I was trying to clean up the tail, in walks the square leg umpire at eleven. No lid. Our keeper told me to bounce him first up. I had my doubts, but did it anyway. It floored him, hitting him smack in the middle of the forehead. Thankfully on a thick bit of bone.

He should have been wearing a lid. There was nothing in the rules to say I couldn’t do it. But it wasn’t the ‘right’ thing to do. If he’d hung around for a few overs, yes, but first up to a number eleven?

You have to have some compass and responsibility, whether its verbals, catches, bouncers. Whatever.

When I played cricket, one incident sticks in my mind. I took a catch down leg side that had clearly to me come off the thigh pad. The bowler and slippers appealed and the umpire, a well known and respected senior panel umpire, gave it out. My instinct was to wave my hand in that ‘not out’ sort of gesture. The batter saw it and stood his ground. He challenged me and then the umpire about was it a fair catch. What would you have done there?

He did not cheat.

If you’re given out, you’re out. If you’re not, you’re not. Walk if you want, but there is no obligation, certainly not in a match at this level.

I watched Clarke do just what Broad did in Adelaide in 2010, only England still had a DRS, and Clarke made it very obvious he was unhappy with it being reviewed, and the rather obvious outcome. You reap what you sow…

Anyway, he’s out now – top score against Oz too. Good on him!

In that case, I would have said to him that i had taken it cleanly, but that I didn’t think he’d nicked it. I would also say to him that he obviously did think he HAD nicked it because he’d started to walk. If he had any sense of fair play he would go, in my opinion. But ultimately that would be up to him. I wouldn’t have been bothered if the rest of the fielders gave him a hard time if he’d stayed put.

I have seen a couple of these types of ‘too many people trying to do the right thing’ incidents as well, but at least these ended in laughter rather than rancour.

Aleem Dar is a fine umpire btw. He revolutionised test umpiring almost single handedly by breaking with accepted practice and giving batters out lbw to spinners even if they had got a big stride in. The number of instances where he has been shown to be right on these is outstanding.

That was another pet hate of mine. Batters questioning decisions if they felt they’d got a decent stride in.

On a sub note, have a look at a picture of Robin Smith batting in the early 90s. He used to wear youth pads with extra padding above the roll, where his knee actually was. This was to get marginal lbws to go his way when the umpire was using the knee roll as a guide!

Down at Bell’s end…

*sniggers*

Just saw Smith blatantly cheating – claiming a catch that was clearly off the pad. Burn him!

Hmmm, another 2 wkts down and a 300 lead so far.

Not enough IMO

Jimmy Anderson ton FTW 😉

Aggers saying only 4.7% of matches where there’s been a chase of >300 have been won by the side batting last.

I’m happy to be marginally confident

Hmmm, another 2 wkts down and a 300 lead so far.
Not enough IMO

Well 300 would already be a record run chase in a fourth innings at Trent Bridge, and the ball is swinging. 300-odd should be plenty

Yep, if we can’t defend 300 odd in the last dig on a dry turner then England will have either bowled and fielded incredibly badly, or been well beaten by an outstanding batting performance. Neither of which I think will happen.

If I was the Aussies I would be worried about the rest of the series. Their seamers have moved the ball far less than England’s and Agar is not the bowler that Swann is.

Agars innings was fantastic, fairy tale stuff, but it was a freak occurence. Without it, oz would have been out of contention by lunch on the second day.

Excellent – finally got TMS and TV in sync here in Oz. Took a lot of effort mind you!

Well, it’s a big target to chase, but a solid start so far… Given their instructions would have been to get through to lunch with no loss of wickets, they’ve still scored 4 runs an over, interesting don’t you think? Target is now revised to 283, and that’s less than the record for Trentbridge 😉

😀 😉 Let’s see what the next session brings… Yet another twist? Or the standard predictable outcome the Poms are expecting? I’m off to bed, so will see what news the morning brings, night all 😀

I would proffer that England are 50 runs shy of safety and despite the potential for prodigious turn, the hot sun will make it flat and slow and little chance of swing either way and the seam less effective as the ball softens.

The Aussies will be saying that they need only 50 odd runs per session and on that basis are well in with a shout.

It’ll be over by tea tomorrow with the Aussies winning by 4 wickets.

You heard it here first and if I was a betting kinda chap, I’d have a wiggle on that as I reckon the odds would be quite favourable.

No lots of credit to you whatever the result – though if he had been stumped it would look much different

Either way Aussies have been competitive, which surprised a few of us, and it has definitely been a game

A lot of credit to be taken from this performance whatever the actual result turns out to be

Ok I’m officially starting to worry now.

Its has been interesting and yes they seem to be on the upper hand and England need to scuttle a few and fairly quickly

Keep going Aussie. It would be better to see a classy win than a dirty one!

Oh give it a rest. 🙄

Their appeal for Trott’s wicket was just as ‘dirty’ as Broad standing his ground. I bet most of them knew Trott had nicked it.

Or how about cynically using DRS for speculative LBW shouts, which isn’t what it was designed for, then running out of appeals and throwing a hissy fit? Really classy.

It would be better to see a classy win than a dirty one!

Why would it be a dirty win?

Get in! Collapse starts now hopefully.

What a dirty cheat Watson is, why didn’t he walk as soon as he was given out? 😉

Watson’s a slow learner on this review business, isn’t he…

Oh give it a rest.

Yes that might just happen

You think he should have walked most folk dont
As others note it is not the only point in this game where the umpires decision and the reality were different

Arguably Trotts one broke the actual rules of the game rather than just your spirit of the games rules

FWIW I think batsmen should actually walk but it has been decades since this actually happened at test level and as Boycs said no one will be recalling Tritt to have another go so swings and roundabouts and all that. it might be better if everyone did but the reality is no one does and had that been an aussie batter he would also have stood there [ and possibly appealed if given out 😛

The scoundrel

Sorry forget that different views could not be tolerated!

I have never justified others cheating either, quite the contrary. But I would like to see Aussie’s now complete a classy victory with a big final innings. (BTW, Not my rules JY – the spirit of the game is written in clearly as referenced earlier.)

For some, the swings and roundabouts are Trott and Broad. Fair enough. For me it would be an Aussie win. So go Aussie!!

(mods feel free to delete, if we can only post if supporting one team!)

It’s not about not tolerating different views, it’s that you keep labouring the same tired point, whilst ignoring the massive hypocrisy involved.

If you want to support Australia that’s absolutely fine, but your reasons are totally spurious.

Sorry forget that different views could not be tolerated!

No, you forget that incorrect views will be gently educated.

That Broad cheated is such a view. But to hold it also means that Watson is a cheat too for not walking. Which sort of removes any ‘class’ you seem to be bestowing on our antipodean visitors.

The hypocrisy – Ramdin a nasty (WI) cheat, Broad a (English) man who plays hard and fair. Quite QED.

Can’t tell Zokes as only listening to TMS on the radio. I have no desire for the Aussies to break the rules (including 1.4), but would like them to score the runs fairly and squarely. I doubt they will though.

Sorry forget that different views could not be tolerated!

No one is saying this they seem to suggest that you refrain from making the same point ad naseum

mods feel free to delete, if we can only post if supporting one team!

Have you asked Psychle which team he supports and whether he feels he is being prevented from this by the discourse?

The hypocrisy – Ramdin a nasty (WI) cheat, Broad a man who plays hard and fair. Quite QED

Do you need this straw man explaining to you again?
Apparently you can suggest we are all racist for disagreeing with you whilst also imploring us to tolerate others view – are you tolerating others as citing racism seems a low blow tbh. You then have the audacity to suggest we are hypocrits …oh the ironing

The hypocrisy – Ramdin a nasty (WI) cheat, Broad a (English) man who plays hard and fair. Quite QED.

You keep saying this, but actively pretending to have taken a catch isn’t the same as just standing your ground and waiting for the umpire’s call. It just isn’t – no matter how many times you say it.

Claiming racism is pretty pathetic too tbh.

He was quite clearly out LBW. He was given out by the umpire, instead of choosing to follow rule 1.4, and play within the spirit of the game, he challenged the umpire and reviewed it. Then, when he got it shown to him on a very big TV screen, wandered off muttering.

As Grum says, by all means support Oz, but do it for the right reasons, rather than taking the self-flagellating sanctimonious stance you have.

Have you asked Psychle which team he supports and whether he feels he is being prevented from this by the discourse?

He’s being prevented by lack of commitment – I’m in the same time zone as him and I’m still up with the beer and Boycs

Nothing to do with race otherwise I would have used a racial adjective rather than a national one. Agreed with dannyh, it’s about being disingenuous . One rule for the oppo, the other for us. Now that is hypocrisy.

Unlike you I am not accusing anyone. Merely criticising a style of behaviour and a rationale for it. Not need to make it personal.

One rule for the oppo, the other for us. Now that is hypocrisy.

Not at all. We’re playing by the rules Australia play by. Now stop being a whinging pom.