Hi All,

I'm fairly new here, got back into riding after a 6 year lay off back in 2007. Decided I'd pick up where I left off so bought a Kona Shred to fling about in the park.

3 years and about 1500 XC/AM km later I have decided that a medium jump frame is not the ideal XC tool despite buying the longest seat post I could find!!!!

I mainly ride XC to work (About 15 miles each way on mixture of proper off road and gravel tracks) but do enjoy a bi yearly excursion into the Coed-y-brenin and contemplating some trips to the alps.

I have a bit of money stashed away, and after reading several bike radar reviews have a few AM full sussers in mind…. (Mostly as chain reaction have RM Altitude Carbon frames in at around £1600 and Turner 5-spots at around £1500)

But they are v. v. v. expensive (IMO), I'm willing to pay the price if they are worth it, but I don't want to be left feeling ripped off. Final thing to say is that I intend this to be my last frame purchase for a long time (My last one managed 10 years of sterling services before Southampton pikeys thieved it.)

Any advice would be happily taken.

Muddy Love,

Dom

Do you really need FS? If you are concerned abotu cost, a long travel hardtail could be the thing – especially if you use it to get around on. Riding to and from work on say an Orange 5 isn't the most fun.

True… I have thought about that, hence looking at the all mountain frames as they have been consistently reviewed in the mags as being worth it. As I have the money and want a 'do everything' bike they seemed the way forward.

When you can get a nice FS frame for what, a grand, and a LT hardtail for a fifth of that.. it's hard to justify.

If I wanted one bike to do everything it'd probably be a LT HT. Although funnily enough now I have 5 bikes I don't feel I need a LT HT 🙂

That rocky mountain is lovely though……

santa cruz have some nice bikes at your price range. ive got an old style heckler and its a really good bike. maybe something like a blur would suit you?

otherwise the 2010 RM's do look good! or there's the trademark Orange 5?

It actually makes a lot more sense to buy complete bikes I think than frames, in many cases.

@ molgrips: Just read some of the thread on LT steel bikes… The one that was stolen was a rigid steel bike – soooooo much nicer to ride than my alu kona, but hey didn't know that then!

@backhander: Yes, yes it is!

How about an Anthem X? The geometry even though a tad slacker on the latest models is still very much XC / so it will feel fine on the commute and if you want it more aggressive put 5" forks on it. It will save you 600-700£ quid from the ones you are considering now and will probably be at least half a pound lighter if not more.

I have an Orange 5, and riding to work on it is a chore and also quite slow. An HT with windable forks would be better.

The giant does sound interesting, but (don't ask me why) I don't like Giants!?!

The other thing is the discount with CRC (I like to feel I'm getting a deal!!!!!!!!)

Plus the 76deg seat angle sounds interesting… I really am sold on the RM, but am well aware it might just be because it looks adn sounds very pretty!

I had a test ride on an Alu Altitude last year – very nice bike, could be ridden slow but liked to go fast 🙂

If it was in my size I'd buy that off CRC

if i was to have one bike to rule them all, as aposed to a quiver of options, it would HAVE to be a 130mm travel hard tail, if i could afford one, a cotic soda 🙂

as it is i have a trance and a summer season.

trance is great, nice and light, all day winner, bit of a gate.

On one is a bit small, kind of jumpy, very slack, very confident and a right giggle 🙂

considered getting a 456 frame?
or a FS AM bike, and keeping the shred for dicking about on…?

I haven't heard much about the 456, but seen the thread and everyone dribbling over them. the biggest problem I have is that I can't find anywhere which has any of the frames I want to test ride 🙁

Having limited past experience all I know is that I preferred my steel hard tail over the Alu one – even if it was a no name wonder from Toys R us!!!!!!

Been looking at a Pace 506 as well, but there aren't any discounts on them so feel my money would be better spent on a discounted frame (hence the RM)

The thing is, these days, £1500 buys a very, very nice complete bike……

That is true… however I am a habitual up-grader and enjoying building the bits together myself… I have plenty of fairly nice bits on the Shred (Think mutton dressed as lamb) which I would more than happily transfer over to the new frame leaving me with the Shred frame for, as Olly said, dicking about on, with some cheaper components.

456 is a bit porky (nearing 2.5kgs) but its tough with it.
and more to the point, they are cheeeeap, and have nice geometry.

Mines a summer season, so slack as a slack thing, but if your daaaaan the saaaf west your welcome to come have a go on it.

if i were you, i would get a 456 and shift the shred bits over onto it.

except single speed since i ripped the mech off, and with DH tyres now.

placed by cement mixer to make it look svelte 😉

I'd definitely go the complete bike full suspension route. For the past few years, through summer, I have commuted on full suspension; my journey is 10 miles minimum and 35 miles maximum depending on which route I take. Either way it is about 50% on/off road mix. I have never found it more of a chore on the full sus'. I have done a comparison of my times and there is no difference worth mentioning except that on the longer route it is far comfier for that length of time in the saddle than on the HT.

A mate has just bought a Specilized FSR xc Comp for £1500 and he commutes from near east midlands airport to Nottingham city on a daily basis quite happily and says he'll never go back to HT.

One of the other reasons for going full sus is that at some points my trail becomes a bit of a high speed bone shaker which often leaves me slightly out of control, before I got my SPD's I would often get shaken off of the pedals, I've tried looking for smoother lines but there is only so far you can deviate on a track which is about 3 foot wide!

Although I think a steel hard tail *might* be more compliant!

Sounds like bad technique

I'd probably buy a nice HT frame (kinesis xc120; £275 Prince albert £280) for the bits off of your shred for commutes and look at a well priced nice second had FS like this;
http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/trek-remedy-8-11
or
http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fs-4-month-old-trek-fuel-ex8-root-beer-for-sale-reduced-to-1050
or
http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fs-09-specialized-pitch-prolarge
Commencal 5.5s can often be seen cheap and this leaves you someting for the trails and you could use it to commute when the weathers nice and you want to take the long way home 🙂
You'll still spend less than if you got the (albeit beautiful) RM frame.

What bike is it, mildred?

If you have lots of rocks, then FS is for you.

Apart from going slower (Which is boring) I don't see how I can improve… any potential pointers? (I am hitting about 40km/hr at this point)

29er hard tail will work very nicely for commuting and the trails – avoid a full sus, you'll regret it when commuting.

@molgrips: Not rocks, but lots of roots, and holes and trail churned up by horses. However I do like riding the rocky bits when I am up in Wales.

@Futon: But wouldn't I regret the 29s when I go away for my weekends of hard n fast riding at the trail centres?

Read my post above, you can have both a HT and a FS!
Just buy wisely.

if you want a fs that lasts get the turner, got a 7yr old 5 spot still going strong and if the worst does happen turner warrenty and customer service is superb

Have you noticed the Chumba advert above? Chumba VF2 frame, fox float qr15 fork, hope wheels, thomson stem and post and Chumba saddle and lock on grips for £1950, bargain 🙂

The major manufactures include good kit at a small fraction of what you would pay for it so you will definitely get much better value by buying a complete bike. The bits you have may be fine, but not right for the frame you choose, especially forks, brakes, seatpost wheels, stem, bars.

Get a complete new bike and sell your complete bike or as bits on the classifieds here then use that to upgrade any component of what you are buying. Go to a good LBS and talk to them – they may even do you a part ex.

Go for a full suss with at least 120mm travel and pro-pedal or lockout and you will have a bike that does everything. Bikes to consider IME should include
Santa Cruz (my 1st choice)
Giant
Trek
Specialized

you will definitely get much better value by buying a complete bike.

+1. Last frame I bought was a Kona Heihei at what, £1k or so. Complete bike £1600. Can't go wrong with that. I bought the frame cos it was an insurance replacement and wanted to build it to a higher spec.

This may be true, but I've already bought bits which don't come as standard on anything sub £5k… I could buy a complete bike and then swap the bits I want over selling the Kona with the bits I don't want…

But… Could I get a frame that I want? I understand the Cruz', Giants and Trek's are all good bikes, but if I've got the opportunity to get something properly special such as the RM, Pace or Turner then I'd prefer to do that. I want a bike that I lust over! This is going to be a toy… it needs to be something that I will feel guilty for not riding. I just don't think a Trek etc will do that as there are so many around!

There just seems to be a complete lack of information from normal people who can give an insight into the dealer support when things go wrong or maintenance is required (Turner accepted.)

I see plenty of Trek's and even more Specialised bikes but went for a ride few Saturday's ago with another 24 guys… Not one Giant other than mine :p I felt pretty unique!

More expensive doesn't necessarily mean better.

The RM seems a bit of a gamble to me as it's largely unproven. The 5-Spot is likely to be a very good bike and Turner seem to have a good rep for long-term customer service, but still you could get a complete Zesty 214 for a few hundred more.

I'd definitely buy a complete bike and swap your bits over. It's what I just did when I bought my new Zesty.

You might be better with a 4" travel frame, maybe with 120mm forks or a 120mm trail bike.
Santa Cruz Superlight frame or full build, or Trek Fuel EX8 would be well worth a look.

look at GT too. If you're after a FS wid about 6'' suspension look at the GT Sanction on PaulsCycles.

Although it wouldnt be fantastic for regular commuting, it would be good for those downhills

Molgrips, For the main I've been on a 5 but as of last year Its a been a Nicolai.

My commute isn't rocky in any way, but the long one is varied and includes bridleways, canal sides and riverside. I just find full sus' more forgiving on the lower back.

If you do want a boutique frame I'd go Nicolai every day of the week. They look industrial but are seriously well built, and you can customise loads of it to make it truly unique.

Whyte 19 Steel? Try before you buy, nice feel. Not too much travel you can't use it every day but slack and twangy enough to have serious fun. My colleague loves them too but the lure of the 150mm Pronghorn was too great (amazing climber too).

I agree that More expensive doesn't necessarily mean better, that's why I'm trying to find info out about the different bikes. Found the manufacturers threads on mtbr forums so will be checking them out. Zesty do look good – but again… just don't have that 'X' factor!

I think the sanction would be a bit excessive… I don't do any freeride any more hence the move away from the Kona. The force however looks quite good, and there is a carbon one 😀 Just looking up costs.

I'll have a look at the Nicolai (Never heard of them before)

The Steely does look good…

WOW! Just looked at a Nicolai build here:

http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=73407

(Sorry for linking to another forum)

looks like I have another frame to consider!