ok i need a front lite shortly as the nights are drawing in…. so what are people buying…..
i saw a nice 'barrel shaped' 'Hope Vision' light that was in the LBS , but its just batterries only. this year im after a re-chargeable light…. are there any other barrel shaped similar products on the market only smaller than the Hope vision, as i saw one on a someones bike last winter but not sure of the 'make'…

This should see you right. Bit more expensive than a vision one tho.

http://www.exposurelights.com/

Sounds like Hope Vision1. Ok for commuting but too narrow beam off road.
DealExtreme.
Me,[url=http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5790] me,[/url] me,[url=http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.15642] & me.[/url]

takisawa2, your so last year, just get the bike specific light. 🙂

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.25149

i've just got the DX and it looks really good, trying it out very shortly! 😀

I always look at these threads and wonder why would you buy that over price piece of tat from Hope (I love there wheels and brake BTW) and not the DX light?

Wasn't there some negative views on here re the DX bike specific light, not the P7, when sombody took it apart to examine?

Beware the DX light

I've seen posts by people who had issues/failures with this light.

Trust certain types to recommend it 🙄

Also, there was a forum member review/strip-down of the DX light.

It doesn't look to be very good.

CC.

what? It was taken to piece and a bit of crap found in it, and some heat compound was recommended, this is not the end of the world, neither are the failures.
Have you never had a failure? My Lupine Edison 5 £500 when it came out failed on me 3 times over the last 4 years, does that mean all Lupine lights are crap, get a grip and wise up.

Buy the dx, buy a spare just in case the 1st fails, they'll still be better & cheaper than those Hopes.

Wow is it light season already, roll on those threads.

It will be interesting too see who brings out the next new technology, apart from Troutie and others who out of the big players (lupine, hope, exposure) are using MCE and XPE led's.

Exposure Toro and Diablo are using a single P7 and these products are not even advertised on their web site yet.

So it appears, though not surprising that these guys are 12 months behind.

Z1ppy.

I was just passing on what I've read about the light on this forum.

I have all the grip I need and am plenty wise thanks. Which is why I don't have a Lupine or a DX.

The emitter in the DX appears to be bonded in with some sort of general epoxy. That being the case, are you recommending that each purchaser, then proceeds to dismantle their new light, correct the design flaw and reassemble ?.

Perhaps its you that needs to "get a grip and wise up."

"Buy the dx, buy a spare just in case the 1st fails"

What great buying advise that is. Heck, why not buy two of everything while you're about it 🙄

Sad to see whores to the Chinese export monster getting so worked up.

Try buying British, is my advise.

CC.

Easy but the MTE P7 from deal extreme.Brilliant bit of kit and massively better than the Hope Vision 1.
You will need a charger,2 x 18650 protected cell batteries,and a mount too,but with current excahnge rates should be around £40 -50.
Service is good and deliverey normally takes approx 1 week.

if funds allow surely? the design flaw also can be solved by trout on here too(if there indeed is one on every unit)? he's british?

it can't be ignored either that these lights are £50. £50. Thats 25% of the cost of a 'mainstream' manufacturer. Tbh if i'd known in time i would have seriously considered one of the trout lights, but i've seen of enough people who've had problems with various £200-300 lights to know that i'll take my chances and be a whore to the chinese export monster 😉

Trust certain types to recommend it? What does that mean? That I'm the type of person that hates to see ppl ripped off by over priced kit? Well thats me if that what you were implying.

I buy British when the product is worth while, Hope lights are not now (they have been in the past), but if you look at my thread history you see me desperately searching for some 2nd Hope wheels, as I believe they are well worth it.

I bought a Lupine when they were the best on thing on the market and worth while (to us) compare to the rubbish Halogens available at the time.
I was then left wondering where the money had been spent when it came to trying to warrenty them, if you read the P7 bike torch thread fully you'll see that even though the company are in Hongkong, they are not ignore ppl with problems, and have even re-paid postages cost, a lot better support than I got from a certain german company.

I bought the DX torch last year when the lupine finally started to give up, and along with my 10 m8's we have about 16 or more of them, with oh look what a surprise, NO failures!!!!!!! (along with the hundred of other mtb'er who did they same)
Yes there have been ppl saying they've had failures, but it's a cheap product that the company will warrenty – I'll happily buy one of them when I need a new torch & keep recommending them till I'm blue in the face

Wasn't there some negative views on here re the DX bike specific light, not the P7, when sombody took it apart to examine?

No, in that thread the light expert guy said "I would buy one if I was in the market for a budget light." and "I aint gonna sell many of my hi quality state of the art led kick ass lights now ."

It does appear that some people have had dead on arrival ones that have needed to be warrantied, although it seems like there is a good warranty service (and no "it's a switch failure, not covered under warranty – a new switch is £100" like you hear about some fancy lights.

Joe

Really been loving my Exposure MaxxD and Joystick combination.

Even better than light threads are the light geeks arguing on the light threads….

captain crash you didnt read the strip down on the dx bike light properly, it was reviewed by Trout the STW homebrew lighting guru, his "its not good news" tag was in respect of how good the light was for the money and how difficult it was to compete with, the one stripped was an early light and others since then when stripped down didnt have the same faults.
Its a lot of light for the money.

I bought the torch before the bike specific light came out, if I was buying now it would be the bike specific light.

Z1ppy.

My first post wasn't actually written with you specifically in mind, so ease off on the paranoia, is my advise.

Oh, yeah, hold on while I research the last 10 posts by each member who posts on the STW forum 🙄

What China and India are doing at the moment is making our economic situation in the UK, even worse, UK imports increased last month, widening our deficit.

I am fed-up with "made in China", more so as so many UK people are losing their jobs at the moment.

Go buy your far-eastern produced, imported items if you wish, and I hope your job never gets exported to China. And when the Chinese make everything and we're all out of work, who'll buy from them then ?.

I would assume that the author of this thread isn't looking for a light which requires an external battery, for if they did, then I'd probably be joined on here by others recommending items from Trout and Smudge.

"Yes there have been ppl saying they've had failures" Right !, and I was JUST passing this on, for the authour of this thread to CONSIDER, you know, a balanced set of posts/opinions, people posting on here both for and against the DX light, etc. Free country (so they tell us) and I was just giving my opinion.

I do hope you will allow me to do that at least, Z1ppy.

Now, take a chill-pill.

NickC, what was that argument thread you started yesterday ?…. 😆

CC.

Tinsy.

Yeah, well, you keep buying Chinese stuff. Your job is well and truely being hunted down by the Chinese.

I read the thread well enough to know that the light T stripped didn't mount the LED onto a thermal conducting paste/epoxy.

My comments are anti cheap chinese cr4p. Yours are pro. Each to their own.

CC.

My Paranioa is fine thanks you but your talking rubbish and it needs commenting on before ppl take you seriously (you aimed you 2nd post specifically at me, so by implication the 1st was too).

I didn't expect you to do any digging (unless its to do decent research instead of headline picking), I'm mentioned my history only to expand on my "buy british when it's worth while" theme.

ROFLMAO the end of the world is nigh cause a English mtb-er's grab a bargain from overseas, get real or are you Cressers trolling?
By suggesting this rubbish, you're not giving ppl a balanced opinion, your just hyping up the std rubbish spouted by Nick Griffin and co. to make a point you want, instead of giving a balance opion, as per Troutie (balanced) P7 bike light thread.

If Hope and lumi-cycle et all, had bothered to keep up with the technology (not exactly the latest is it, being as P7 LED have been available for well over a year) then I'd be recommending them, but they aren't so I'll recommend this cheap decent HK import.

chill pill indeed, try taking a reality one

>I am fed-up with "made in China", more so as so many UK people are losing their jobs at the moment.

Err..where do think the componentry in these things is made ? Singapore/asia/china etc, like the majority of consumer goods (or otherwise). Everyone's competing (largely) on price, they'll get kit manufactured where it can be done well and/or most economically – once you're selling lots of units a small saving is well worth some degree of effort in pushing manufacturing elsewhere.
It's all very well manufacturing in the uk, but you're got to sell on features (IMO), doing it on price you're not going to last long.

Z1ppy.

"My Paranioa is fine thanks you but your talking rubbish and it needs commenting on before ppl take you seriously"

Yay !, Z1ppy defends and aids the exporters of china. You're their hero.

Hhmm. You're now telling me, who I may have had in mind when I wrote my first post ???, oh dear. I think I'm the authority on what I'm thinking, not you. But you continue if that makes you happy, bless.

Please, are you the only person in the UK buying Chinese made products ?, how many people in this country are, ever given that any thought ?.

Oh, I suppose I invented the trade deficit figures, just for this thread, and what the heck, they don't matter anyway. Who needs an economy, obviously you're happy with todays economic situation in the UK.

You just keep on buying two lights at a time, cos you think one will fail.
Hilarious.

I do hope that your DX light doesn't fail while your on a stretch of DH in the pitch black. Cos if that happened, the consqeuences would still justify buying the DX.
Oh, I see !, you'd have both of them mounted to your bars and switched on….just in case 😆

I'm sticking to my opinion and you can spout-off all you like.
Sorry, until you're blue in the face. Although I'd suggest a darker shade of crimson right now, judging by your posts.

Ah !, being fed-up with Chinese imports and their ECONOMIC impact (thats me) now links me, in your mind, to Nick Griffin….weird !.

Hhmmm. Perhaps a bit more than a chil-pill is needed for you 🙄

Yes, I agree with you, take both a chill-pill and a reality pill, and no alcohol 😆

CC.

you are CRESSER's I claim my prize!

Jond.

"It's all very well manufacturing in the uk, but you're got to sell on features (IMO), doing it on price you're not going to last long. "

Thats so true, and so very sad.

Anyone care to suggest why manufacturing in the UK is so expensive now….

CC.

Sorry, don't speak Zippanese.

What is Cressers ?.

CC.

Prize ?.

Yes, one white jacket, with very long arms.

LOVL now.

CC.

I guess its about "value for money", if we are to take the position of don't buy Chinese, then 90% of the electronics in my house, car, office would vanish.

I guess because MTB lights are not a mass market product (such as blue ray players, LCD TV's) and a s such the mass volume and lower prices do not add up.

I wish they would as when you see an exposure P7 "torch" at over £260.00 it feels a bit wrong.

This is the man by the way who bought a Mk 3 exposure enduro turbo light back in '07.

It was then new, radical and worth a punt, I have found the after sales support to be good and would like to buy one of their new P7 lights, but for £275.00 maybe not.

MLB.

Yeap, too true, we've all got loads of Chinese made stuff at home, and it seems diffcult today to buy anything else, generally.

Good point, MTB lights won't be their biggest export, but they'll sell that light in other countries too.

So not insignificant numbers, I'm thinking.

🙂

CC.

I think the big light boys have a view of what a product is worth rather than the true material/overhead to sale cost.

Ay-Up gave the market a kick up the a$$ a year or so ago and by the looks of the web site may be close to a few changes.

Yes its all free market and the purchaser takes his choice.

My view is the technology and cost for components 3 years ago has reduced and thus a degree of these savings and efficiencies should be passed onto the purchaser, mind you I am not a shareholder of Exposure, Lupine et al.

OK can we go back to talking about lights please Zippy, Captain et al……please?

I ride bikes and work in an office, dont know a whole lot about the technology surrounding turning night into day. Can someone do me a quick transaltion re: all the terms you are banding about?

Lupine, XPE, MTE, P7, WTF etc etc please expand. Some of us perhaps including the OP would maybe like to know what is what. How much power is enough and how is it measured? 1200 lumi? what does that mean?

Thanks

Lupine, expensive German lights

XP-E About to be superceeded, but fave of the moment for some homebrewers, LED by Cree.

MTE, a set of four LEDs in one "die" I think they call it. Just looks like a slightly larger XR-E LED.

P7, think its a torch from DX

Please correct if I've got any of that wrong.

"what is enough" well, everyone has their opinion about that, and to a certain extent, it will depend on where you ride.

If all you're doing is commuting, then obviously you won't need the fierce outputs some of the higher-end lights generate.

Likewise, if you're going off road into the black, then someting like Trout's light is probably well advised.

Trout has his own website, and he has issued a few threads on the Candle power forum, I think its called.

So, where/what for, will you be using a light.

Solo.

>Thats so true, and so very sad

I don't disagree, it's simply that production costs are lower, primarily labour. And in recent years the capability of Chinese industry has improved a lot.
Unfortunately labour savings can also be at the cost of working conditions and more environmentally-sound working practices – (eg the clothing in dustry and sweat-shop labour). In some cases you can vote with your conscience/wallet, often it's just impractical/impossible, as montylikes beer wrote re electronics goods.

You've probably never heard of Foxconn, for example, but in the electronics industry they're reasonably well known – they do the manufacturering for Apple (iphone at least). They've been in the press a few times for possibly dubious practices – or at least, of some of their employees have (just checked, in one case they admitted they'd broken Chinese labour laws).

Cycling's one area where people seem to like buying more niche items, plus much is fairly competitive. Some of my cycling gear is Lusso/Sidi/CorinneDennis 'cos it's well-priced/well-made (and TBH, I like the fact that it *is* made in the UK/europe). But Assos is getting a bit rich for me 😉 – and doesn't quite fit 'value for money', particularly when one off might wreck something.

Shimano (AFAIK) used to do all their production in Japan. but now have manufacturing in China too.

Hey don't moan at me, he started it mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmahhhhhhhhh!!!

Lupine – overprice german tat 😈
XPE, MTE, P7 – type of LED's available , though the Dealextreme torch is also named P7, so it can get confusing
WTF – what the f*ck (are we still doing here)

How much power is enough You can never have too much power IMO, until you get to the point where your light is so bright the glare off the trail blinds you (troutie has managed this…). Others say the minimum is enough, so it's up to you really. A single P7 torch is a good place to start IMHO

and how is it measured? 1200 lumi? what does that mean? That where it get complicated as it's all very difficult to measure in a standard way and compare between lighting systems. In all the threads I've read (quite a lot), my mind starts to melt when they discuss this, so maybe some-one more knowledgeable can help. Even phots's aren't a great guide as the way the camera is setup can distort the results… unless all the photo are from the same camer on the same night maybe…

anyway I'm off to find trouties "power of the sun" lighting test thread… t'is very funny.

Jond.

Agree, you and MLB make good points.

🙂

CC

The lighting manufacturers do not make the LED chip sets, what they do is to source supply from the cleaver chip manufacturing companies such as Cree as well as others.

These manufacturing companies are pushing the boundaries of what an LED can do in terms of light output, power demand and current.

These chip sets are used for many applications not just MTB light sets.

The light companies (exposure, hope, Petzl) take these chip sets and place then into their own housings.

It is no great secret that the hope 4, lupine Betty and Exposure 4 led look the same as they are using the same chip set.

So why are the prices high when we assume the chip sets are getting brighter, lower power demands and I guess cheaper.

That is the question.

MTB Britainlight reviewRead this for a more practical and honest appraisal of the P7 light and what you get:http://www.mtbbritain.co.uk/mountain_bike_lights_review_led.html

I say whenever possible support your local British eccentric, thus Trout and Smudge are knocking together a 600 lumi, battery and charger as we speak (arent you boys?). Homebrew light, battery in a bottle on the bike, all strapped to a Ti hardtail from Todmorden by way of Chattanooga…..just so right.

For anyone who still speaks in laymans terms I will post back after a couple of night rides and tell you how I get on. Needs to keep me upright at speed in forest pitch blackness, was out again last night using some borrowed from a pal.

Isnt night riding just great fun? Lovely balmy evening and dry trails, most fun I've had on a bike this summer.

>So why are the prices high
Again, place of production, units produced, added features – more lighting levels/modes, bells/whistles..also what the market will stand, price-wise.

The price of high power leds (like other silicon devices) drops as they become mass market – but the next big thing will always be a little more expensive due to lower production yields initially and potential market sales. Even then, once a production process is mature, there's a minimum prices it won't drop below – the price is based partly on silicon area per led and yield (no of leds per silicon wafer)

Anyway, that's getting a little away from the 'what lights' question 😉

what's the runtime on the P7?

I def still don't regret investing in my Hope 4 but I did balk at how much Lupine charged for their equivalent model