You’re paying for the uplift only….the trails (including signage) is volunteer labour.

Probably best to stick to BPW if something this trivial ruins your day at FoD….also means less traffic there for the rest of us!

I know this- but that’s really beside the point. This is criticism of the venue, not of the trails and certainly not of the builders. I dig at glentress and innerleithen but I don’t take offence when people slag the cafe 😆

Does flyup contribute back to the trails, out of curiosity? I left a donation as well when I picked up the map, but a lot of people won’t see any distinction between the different elements. It’s probably their customers that would benefit the most from decent navigation too.

I think there’s probably a gap between how you see it, and how it’s now presented to the outside world. Because honestly, how else can you describe it as off the beaten track? I’ve been off the beaten track, they don’t have a website, a bike shop, a hog roast, an uplift, and a massive sign saying WELCOME TO OFF THE BEATEN TRACK! ARE THESE TRAILS FOR YOU?

I’m not sure why this is controversial. A business is making money from providing an uplift service and its customers are giving feedback that they would like better signage. I don’t see it’s an issue for the volunteers. Paying customers would like the business to invest some profit in better signs. Why not?

I now expect to be told that the uplift only makes £4 a month and should be supported by gift aid and a race for FOD event.

think there’s probably a gap between how you see it, and how it’s now presented to the outside world. Because honestly, how else can you describe it as off the beaten track? I’ve been off the beaten track, they don’t have a website, a bike shop, a hog roast, an uplift, and a massive sign saying WELCOME TO OFF THE BEATEN TRACK! ARE THESE TRAILS FOR YOU?

I was comparing it to places like BPW where it’s fully booked 3 months in advance, on private land, fully signposted, groomed trails, no chance of taking a wrong turn, everything strava segmented etc etc…..and then you have FoD where the trails are left to deteriorate/wear/bed-in, there’s a lack of mapping and signs, uplifts can usually be booked only a week ahead etc.

Obviously I’m not suggesting that booking with FlyUp is like going into the wilderness in Snowdonia but when comparing uplift venues BPW and FoD are poles apart.
BPW is fun but attracts a certain type of rider who seems to want everything handed to them on a plate with little to no effort on their part, FoD is a little more rough and ready and I prefer it….for me it’s ten times the uplift venue BPW is which is probably why I jump on this thread and get defensive about the place.

There is space for both kinds of venue and I think it’d be a crying shame if FoD went the way of BPW where trails are like footpaths and there is no off piste riding.
If you don’t like FoD don’t visit again, I’ve no great desire to go back to BPW….horses for courses and all that, it doesn’t enter my head that I might not be able to accurately guide an ambulance to my location at the FoD….I think if that was my primary concern when going out for a ride then it’s probably time to take up golf.

You do seem to be confusing a few signs with the whole place getting graded and hard cored though.
As defensive as you are of the FOD you are also very dismissive of BPW and it’s ilk. There is space in the sport for all of these types of riding.
Having ridden for over 20 years, before ‘trail canters’ even existed I feel I have done my wilderness apprenticeship. Trekking fo hours up soulless double track to find that elusive, Magic singletrack descent in the middle of nowhere is as appealing and rewarding to me as nailing the Scalextrix line without coming out of the groove on the trails at BPW for example.
Locally I am happy to while away hours exploring and finding new riding.
Like others though, if I’ve driven a long way to get to a specific destination, it is often far more efficient a use of my time to ride waymarked trails than just head off hoping to find the good stuff. Perhaps as a local you are losing sight of that?
If there is a business making money out of the trails, it would be I. Their best interests to ensure that those using the service can get the best out of it, surely? Having a decent map of the drop off point to main trail head with the main trails marked on it accurately seems to be a sensible idea to me.

There is space in the sport for all of these types of riding.

Perhaps as a local you are losing sight of that?

I did say its good that both BPW and FoD exist as they give different experiences, try both to see which one you like best and revisit that one….seems easy to me.

I’m not local to FoD, its a 3 hr drive for me…..but with the FlyUp guys getting in close to 15 runs a day during the summer its easy to find pretty much everything on that hill.

Not read all of this but.
Maybe some people are expecting signs because they have paid for uplifting and think it’s a commercial venture and part of what they are paying for?

Reading all this, looks like I’m in for a fun day today..

. . . have paid for uplifting and think it’s a commercial venture. . .

Well it is a commercial venture, but what they contribute to the trails (financially) I’ve no idea.

As for the poor sign posting , well that’s part of the charm. Plus there are always loads of riders to ask.

Marko

Well it is a commercial venture, but what they contribute to the trails (financially) I’ve no idea.

That’s the point i’m making.
Maybe people think they are paying for the uplift and the trails.
Maybe the uplift company could pay for some new signs?

If you don’t need signs because you know your way round it’s not going to make any difference to you.
But if you don’t know your way round it’d be a big help.

Was there using the uplift for the first time on Tuesday. As someone said earlier donate £2.00 to get a reasonably up-to-date map of the trails from the bike hire place – Pedalbikeaway.