Viewing 33 posts - 1 through 33 (of 33 total)
  • FIVE-OH Striking
  • willber
    Free Member

    What do you think? Should police be able to go on strike? Do you think it would matter if they did? Just read an article about police asking for the right to strike – I wonder if it would even matter if they did.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    I think the price of taking away the right to strike should be accepting the responsibility that you have to never give them a reason to strike.

    Munqe-chick
    Free Member

    That is because the Winsor report is screwing all coppers over but unlike other jobs we aren’t allowed to strike so Feds mooting we should be allowed to! Interesting debate …..

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    Bregante
    Full Member

    I’ve done 17 years in the cops now. I signed up to a set of pay and conditions which I was told were set in stone. A cast iron guarantee of what I would get back in 30 years time.

    I’m never going to be rich and every day of my career I, and many others like me, put myself at risk of harm to protect others. I love my job and admit to getting a certain amount of pride out of what I do.

    I’ve been a uniform cop as a PC and as a Sergeant and I’ve served many years as a Detective. I have seen people sent to prison for 30 years for horrible crimes and hope to continue doing so for as long as I can. I worked in the riots last year and myself and my team recently received a high commendation for bravery during that time.

    Many people only have negative things to say about the Police Service, however I am lucky enough to say that i work alongside some of the most outstanding individuals I have ever met. Some are arseholes too. We’re human beings.

    However, this government seem intent on destroying the British Police Service as it is today. I am being told that I have to pay more, work longer and get less money out at the end, so why shouldn’t we be given the right to strike?

    project
    Free Member

    Bregnate, just perhaps if you went on strike, but just those guarding politicians, and those ones standing outside no 10, then perhaps they would realise what a good job you all do most of the time.

    If this government keeps knocking back the police, who is going to protect all their rich followers when the new riots start.

    willber
    Free Member

    I am of the opinion that if the police were to strike society would struggle to recover from the fallout that I believe would occur. If people can organise themselves quickly and fluidly – as demonstrated in last years riots, and they knew that for the next 24 hours there would be no police response at all, groups/gangs would run a mock. I agree that the police should never be put in a position where they feel it necessarry to strike. I just wonder, if it actually ce down to it, and police publicly announced they were all on strike for 24 hours or whatever – how would society respond?

    wrecker
    Free Member

    Going out to shoot rioters sound fun.

    wisepranker
    Free Member

    Personally I don’t think any of the emergency services should be allowed to go on strike and that’s coming from a member of the emergency services!

    Munqe-chick
    Free Member

    Well said Bregante! We get screwed and can’t do anything about it just have to accept it and carry on …. along with all the criticism we get thrown at us like the Home Sec during middle of riots. The police service is going through huge changes don’t think it is going to make it better unfortunately.

    markrh
    Free Member

    I would guess they would just bring the Army in to cover for those who did strike (don’t think they would all strike, think what this did to the miners… bit of irony there) they would have little public support as everyone is under the kosh at the moment and I bet most policemen voted tory so they got whats coming to them :wink:.

    wrecker
    Free Member

    The police service is going through huge changes don’t think it is going to make it better unfortunately.

    To be fair, all of the public (and armed) services are, none will be better for it.

    deluded
    Free Member

    I’m an Acting Detective Sergeant with 16 years service.

    Winsor and the Coalition Government are set on destroying the finest police service in the world. I’ve acknowledged on a previous thread that UK Police Forces should not be immune to change in line with other cuts across the public sector, but the reforms are becoming a terrifying inversion of priorities where cost cutting measures being implemented and proposed (by functionaries with a dubious appreciation and understanding of how the job works) put profit over people and consequently accountability and expertise are being eroded.

    Personally speaking, and setting aside moral responsibilities, striking is not an option as it will serve only to weaken our conditions of service even further.

    Occasionally I get the positive feelings that Bregante has detailed but they are on the wane – I’m monumentally hacked off with it all at the moment.

    All the best to the other officers on the forum – there’s a long and rocky road ahead. I’ll be amongst the crowd on the 10th May.

    Munqe-chick
    Free Member

    Don’t worry STWers I will still be there at 75 with my zimmer frame chasing and nicking bike thiefs 😉 agree with some of what Deluded says too.

    wrecker
    Free Member

    Sounds rubbish. I would like to express surprise that the Tories have ringfenced ALL of the guards regiments (where all of the posh boys serve) and are instead cutting many units with far more positive results. Against a lack of sense like this I wish all of the rozzers good luck.
    They’re not even pretending any more.

    Speshpaul
    Full Member

    “I am being told that I have to pay more, work longer and get less money out at the end,”
    “I’m monumentally hacked off with it all at the moment.”

    I’m not having a pop when i say this but welcome to the club.

    belugabob
    Free Member

    However, this government seem intent on destroying the British Police Service as it is today.

    The first step towards this was insisting on calling it the ‘Police Service’ – therby taking away any ‘Force’ that it might have once had.
    The ‘Only police guarding the politicians should go on strike’ idea doesn’t sound half bad – might just focus their minds a bit.

    Bregante
    Full Member

    For those that missed this last night, I’m just going to put ths link up. If you value the work that the Police do, please sign the attached e-petition. if nothing else but to express how stupid it is to expect 60 year olds to do the job that front line officers are expected to do.

    In last years riots myself and 24 other officers confronted almost 1000 rioters. 1000 people who wanted to cause us harm, do damage to property and ruin people’s businesses. Other colleagues worked in excess of 30 hrs straight when they were drafted in to help the Met. Would you want that responsibility in the hands of a group of 60 year olds?

    No Police Officer I know actually wants to strike. It goes against everything that we signed up for when we took the attestation when we first joined up. However this government needs to understand the strength of feeling about these proposals.

    http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/22321

    Sorry for going on. Thanks

    Klunk
    Free Member

    [video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ID80fUT5SwQ[/video]

    mattsccm
    Free Member

    For the same reason that no emergency or crucial service should strike. Its f** ing immoral. Same with teachers, nurses, or anyone who is needed. And thats from a teacher.
    If you don’t like it Leave.

    mattsccm
    Free Member

    Then when we have none conditions will change. Its called market forces.

    MSP
    Full Member

    And thats from a teacher.

    With your lack of understanding of how markets operate in reality, rather than in some idealised fantasy world, I hope your a PE teacher.

    user-removed
    Free Member

    Not sure striking makes a jot of difference. The nhs have this option, have used it and are still being royally screwed. Don’t know if this is due to public suffering, bringing about a shortsighted “welcome to the real world” response or simply due to strikes not being disruptive enough?

    I guess a police strike might get better results than, say, a binman or nurses’ strike…

    project
    Free Member

    From an outsiders view of the Police Force, there is a down skilling and cheaper wages and pensions by employing PCSO,S, a good idea for basic patrolling and answering the phone, but not in public order or theft senarios.

    Making the traffic departments part of larger units, and seperate from the original police force, they are now getting their own traffic offices, not police stations, their vehicles are being branded ,north west motorway patrol, or central motorways unit etc, and there are probably more,new names on the sides of their vehicles.

    Then there is the split off of the specialist jobs , like Forensics, child abuse , and the serious and organised crime unit.

    All quite nice for a big sell off by the governmnet to their freinds, just like the nhs.

    We have seen it with the railways,partialy with the roads, and now the nhs and police,schools and colleges, followed by the fireservice, and ambulance services.

    There should be a few years of disconcent in the following years.

    MSP
    Full Member

    If the police have a big protest march in that there London, who will kettle them?

    xiphon
    Free Member

    Don’t like the conditions surrounding the job? Move on.

    There will be plenty of unemployed people willing to take your job within a second.

    Munqe-chick
    Free Member

    Plenty of unemployed willing to take job, not many could though potentially need 2 A-levels Grade C or above now!

    Have a read of this (slightly off topic).

    http://www.metfed.org.uk/metline?id=1712

    nicko74
    Full Member

    I am being told that I have to pay more, work longer and get less money out at the end, so why shouldn’t we be given the right to strike?

    I can absolutely see where you come from, and you’ve every right to feel aggrieved. But the truth is that everyone* is having to work longer, pay more and get less money out at the end. That’s what the long-term financial crisis (ie the one that’s been brewing since 2000 or so) means. Companies and governments have huge black holes where their pension funds should be – and as pension funds are now so large, they pretty much *are* the stock market, so getting returns over the market is nigh-on impossible.
    Companies are cutting R&D budgets to pay their pension liabilities, this impeding their future profitability and ability to pay pensions of those under 45. There’s a small but real chance that those of us under the age of 35 may never see the pensions that we’ve been promised, as our employers go into some form of bankruptcy protection trying to cover existing pension liabilities.

    None of this is to say that private employees have it any worse at all; being a desk jockey is a very different job and I wouldn’t ever equate it to what the po-po’s do or their importance to our society.
    My point is that we are all getting shafted; we’re all paying both our own and our parents’ mortgages. Private sector employees’ pensions are being cut, and there’s nothing we can do about it. Unfortunately, the public sector faces exactly the same constraints, and its employees are having to face the same cuts – nobody’s sacrosanct*. The difference is I can’t strike, because I don’t have a union and would get sacked.

    *-except of course the bankers, but that’s a different discussion.

    xiphon
    Free Member

    Nicko74 – nail -> head.

    We’re all getting screwed.

    user-removed
    Free Member

    My point is that we are all getting shafted; we’re all paying both our own and our parents’ mortgages.

    I’ve made this point before in relation to NHS cuts and strikes, but it works just as well here; Yes, we’re all getting shafted, but a good number of those in the (just) public sector accepted a lower wage than their private counterparts. Some because of the long term benefits, some due to entirely altruistic reasons. And that, there is the rub.

    gwaelod
    Free Member

    I would guess they would just bring the Army

    this is the default daily Mail/politician answer to everything.

    I do have a little bit of a chuckle when I think about how many spare

    tanker drivers
    firemen
    police officers

    to name 3 recent examples the army have just hanging about waiting to jump into action. All the cuts that others have had done to them over the last few years have hit the army as well, despite fighting a couple of wars. Civilisiation of the forces means people can’t just be orderd out of barracks to fill sandbags, drive lorries anymore…if they have been employed as civvies to fill in forms then they will only fill in forms. Army itself is begoming a smaller and smaller force of soldiers who are increasingly trained for more and more niche specialist tasks. Providing a backstop for the civil authorities who can’t organise themselves properly isn’t one of them.

    As ever when called upon the armed forces will respond, but as every month goes on they are less and less able to do other peoples jobs for them

    Munqe-chick
    Free Member

    Nicko74 you’re paying your parents mortgage!!???? WHAT?

    nicko74
    Full Member

    Doh – looked back at that, and there are various typos that I should have corrected. Pension, not mortgage!

    Yes, we’re all getting shafted, but a good number of those in the (just) public sector accepted a lower wage than their private counterparts. Some because of the long term benefits, some due to entirely altruistic reasons.

    hmmm…. fair point; I’d never seen it pitched in that way, even when I’ve been looking at public sector jobs.
    I think the wider point is that nobody’s getting what they were promised, and as with the ‘granny tax’ (taxed on the number of grannies you have), nothing’s sacrosanct. As someone who’s not retiring for another 30-40 years (tbc, it would seem), my bias obviously lies more towards people my age – although that’s not to say that I think it’s a good thing, or even a choice that should be made, if there were any other option.

    Munqe-chick
    Free Member

    How much do most people pay into their pension though?

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