You read that they’d announced an end date… they’ve been working on the site for 2 years…

True, I did read that. 2019.

Oh, and Nissan up in the air again…

Nissan senior vice-president Colin Lawther:
The decision to expand in Sunderland was based on “a set of circumstances” at that point in time, he said.

“As those circumstances change, and we wouldn’t wait until the end of the process…”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-latest-news-nissan-uk-business-jobs-7000-employees-car-plant-sunderland-a7603721.html

Showing my age, I remember when Fleet St was the new building and we moved from The Old Bailey. I am still getting a hell of a laugh out of STWers defending banks and Goldmine Stacks (Alex Cartoon nickname) / Great Vampire Squid (Rolling Stone Magazine) at that. Goldman is pretty smart with its own money, if they weren’t going to use the building they’d sell it on now.

Just watched this, tremendous stuff from Jacob-Rees. Absolutely humiliated John Major and his intervention yesterday 😀 IDS on Newsnight was good but of course not up to the same surgical standard

[video]http://youtu.be/TNSaUrIYrR8[/video]

@matty you like the other Remainers take the word “considering” and turn it into an inevitability in the same way BMW are considering moving (establishing really) electric/hybrid Mini production in Germany the UK will be considering a tariff free trade deal for cars and manufacturing with Japan.

Tariffs on cars would be a bigger problem for the EU than it would be for the UK and our auto manufacturing.

even when the only folk sat on one side are gullible, charlatan, mad and/or stupid.

Still no respect for those who disagree with you then b r ?

I would say most people made up their mind over Brexit based on 10, 20, 30 years experience of it. As one MP said during the A50 debate this issue has been discussed and played out for decades. It is simply that June 23, 2016 was the first time in 40 years we where given a say.

Loving your work jamba, fingers in ears about any downsides from Brexit on the economy or anything else, but here look at this erudite brexie clown auto fellating himself ! 😉

As for claims it was a considered decision, arrived at over many years

As you have gleefully pointed out by repeating lies about EU, immigrants, etc and keeping the debate focused on emotive issues Vote Leave was able to sway enough people to scrape its (pyrrhic) victory.

Goldman is pretty smart with its own money, if they weren’t going to use the building they’d sell it on now.

They’d sell it off now, off plan, rather than wait ’till it’s finished? Why would they do that?

They will use (at least some of) it, but that shouldn’t be read as they’re going to stick to their plan to move people into the UK… that seems a remote dream in the new Leave era…

Tariffs on cars would be a bigger problem for the EU than it would be for the UK and our auto manufacturing.

Even if that is true, why is it good? Damaging effects on both the rEU and UK industry is good for who? I find no comfort in the rEU being damaged more than us, if it still means job opportunities vanishing here.

Jamba you are a clown

Blighty TV ???

Tariffs on cars would be a bigger problem for the EU than it would be for the UK and our auto manufacturing.

Ha, ha, you do realise that La La land didn’t win best picture Jumbla?

That was a classic JR-M clip!!

Loved the Cassandra bit!!

Astounding, and what do our esteemed leavers think will happen to the rest of the Oxford plant if it’s hit with a 10% tarrif on the 100,000 plus minis that are exported to the european mainland each year, (represents about £150m per year loss assuming they are all base model mini ones)…plus tarrifs on parts and engines if…

“Cabinet ministers have been told to draw up rearguard plans in case Britain crashes out of the EU with no fresh trade deal.

Brexit Secretary David Davis has urged his colleagues to prepare for what critics have dubbed the doomsday “cliff edge” prospect of leaving on World Trade Organisation (WTO) terms – and hefty tariffs.”

A handy reference: WTO rules mean hefty export tariffs on, for example, dairy products (36 per cent), cars (ten per cent), food and drink (20 per cent) and clothing and textiles (10-20 per cent).

@Pigface I did try and find another YouTube channel source but was unable. Inwas glad the clip came up as a suggestion after zi’d watched the official Newsnight one

Kimbers we always said there would be bumps in the road. We quite rightly did ridicule the Armageddon nonsense from Remain, there was even a thread on the ludicrous claims.

Matty the avg tariff is 3% and we already pay those tariifs on clothes/textiles most of which are made in Bangladesh, Vietnam, China etc. Tariff on cars is more than offset by fall in exchnage rate. Problem is with EU facing 10% tariff plus 15% currency costs – that will really hurt sales. 10% tariff will remove EU’s advantage over Japan, South Korea for example. Thats why I am highly confident a tariff free deal will be done on cars/manufacturing. French and German elections this year, they can ill afford tariffs.

Why would it be in other side’s interests to trade under WTO rules?

Is it not preferable for both sides to reach an agreement on free trade?

Yes is is preferable but we understand who we are dealing with. Politicans on the World’s most lucrative gravy train. Also where else can a politician from Luxembourg or Belgium wield so much influence, hardly UN Secrety General material are they ?

10% tariff will remove EU’s advantage over Japan, South Korea

Well my strategy in BMWs shoes would be to phase production over to mainland Europe in the long game, no tarrifs for them, unfortunately huge job cuts and lost tax revenue for us.

I don’t see it being preferable for anyone.

Everyone is a loser under WTO. So talks of anyone wanting to punish anyone else is rather bizarre IMO. And yet the debate seems only to centre on one side of the argument which given that this is a NEGOTIATION seems rather a strange and myopic approach.

Jacob Rees Mogg really is such a loathsome toad. It utterly defies belief that the disenfranchised poor of this country who voted leave seriously believed that people like him had their best interests at heart. Ditto IDS, Gove, Boris and Nigel.

.. but amusing to watch nonetheless esp the classical references

Jam you just can’t stop slinging mud, can you?

Well my strategy in BMWs shoes would be to phase production over to mainland Europe in the long game, no tarrifs for them, unfortunately huge job cuts and lost tax revenue for us.

My guess is that was always the plan since they bought the business. Why make cars in UK when wages in Eastern Europe are so much lower and the countries are literally next door ? I don’t Brexit changes much.

As I said we’ve lost 250,000 finance jobs in last 10 years. Things change.

Nice to see Nissan being about more open, invest loads on money or we are off. Investment good, however, more jobs means more workers, 5% unemployment, doesn’t really help supply workers. So who is going to do the jobs?

Well if that’s correct, you’d have to ask why they would build such a huge plant in Oxford in the first place lol, I worked there for a short period and its so big it’s like a small town.

I’m fairly sure the efficient bean counters at BMW HQ wouldn’t have built it there for a laugh.

We’ve collectively as a country just stuck two fingers up at them, why wouldn’t they move out?

It was there already

My guess is that was always the plan since they bought the business. Why make cars in UK when wages in Eastern Europe are so much lower and the countries are literally next door ?

It’s great to see the EU working, shame we’ll be missing out.

My guess is that was always the plan since they bought the business. Why make cars in UK when wages in Eastern Europe are so much lower and the countries are literally next door ? I don’t Brexit changes much.[/I]

If they only were interested in cheap wages they wouldn’t be also producing Mini’s in The Netherlands. When you’re producing premium products it’s all about quality, and then productivity.

You (and I, we’ve a BMW and a Land Rover) drive premium cars, and when we bought them if we were only concerned about the price we certainly wouldn’t buy the cars we have.

The mini is only one product line of, I don’t know, say 10 core product lines.

Moving the E mini which they were considering producing in the UK, to Germany, not the cheaper Eastern European nations kinda invalidates your idea. And that’s all it is your idea, not what the company has stated it’s intentions are.

Pigface – Member
It was there already

Then thier financial interest in the site it will be even less then, if they didn’t build it, they can ship out the equipment and robotics easy enough, build minis wherever they please without the 10% tariff and walk away.

Did they purchase the site or are they essentially renting? I honestly don’t know, but if they are renting, they’ve got a lot of reasons to move, and not any I can think of to stay.

The site had a huge spend late 90’s early 00’s i can’t remember exactly when, i do remember working on the supply of the new building though.

Doesn’t really matter, it is very easy to move a production line. The timing is also fairly predictable.

All the current cars being built in the UK are going to stay for now. The crunch comes when each model comes to refresh. IF the refresh is within a year or so then it will stay. if the refresh is 4-5 years then the manufacturers will play a waiting game. Obviously they will make plans but i would be shocked if they move production before the end of the production run.

Blunty don’t expect to see any car companies up sticks this side of the next GE in 2020.

Yeh I’d agree with that, but it’s only 3 years away, not much help to the people who work there for job security.

The mini platform will be overhauled at some point and if they are already thinking of doing the E mini in the Netherlands or Germany, it doesn’t bode well for the Oxford workers. Or the UK as a whole, if such a big brand abandons the country, it will influence other potential big multinational investors.

just doing a bit of reading, one thing to watch there is a BMW engine plant in Birmingham that makes the 1.5L units in Minis, and plenty of other beemers. If production shifts away not a good sign.

Well exactly, it’s not just the main plant itself, its all the ‘local’ 3rd party supplier companies, and all their employees that stand to loose out too, and this is just one car manufacturer.

But it’s OK because we’ve ‘taken back control’ and kicked out a few foreign students who were self funded anyway and not costing the country a penny.

Damn foreign students, cross subsidising our kids if they get to study.

As for the eMini… where will the batteries be made? Such a high value drop in part of the final product needs to avoid crossing customs borders… car really needs to be made in the same market as the batteries, no?

My guess is that was always the plan since they bought the business.

My guess is that you know exactly diddly squat about the matter you are pontificating about.

I think really gets me about Jacob Rees Mogg (and his ilk)is that he is the embodiment of that attitude that, us Brits, are just a cut above everybody else and that is why everything’s going to work out fine in the end; all we need to do is reacquaint Europe of this fact.

where will the batteries be made? Such a high value drop in part of the final product needs to avoid crossing customs borders

Given the large size and high weight of them, it would make sense to build them very locally to where the rest of the car is built.
Edit, thinking about it, they could have ‘finishing’ houses in various countries where the cars are shipped with out batteries, and then added at the last minute, but that would require international agreements which the UK seems to be allergic to at the moment.

us Brits, are just a cut above everybody else and that is why everything’s going to work out fine in the end;

I’m sure it will all work out just fine for him and his ilk, whilst he might be witty and eloquent, he was born into serious money, so he can afford to be flippant.

I’m sure it will all work out just fine for him and his ilk, whilst he might be witty and eloquent, he was born into serious money, so he can afford to be flippant.

Always the way, with change comes opportunities if you have the money to take advantage of them. Most people will just do what they can to cope.

I’m sure it will all work out just fine for him and his ilk, whilst he might be witty and eloquent, he was born into serious money, so he can afford to be flippant.

Jacob wasn’t born into serious money. His father was editor of the Times so he was very influential and was one of the great and the good. Whilst his father was no doubt very comfortable and gave his son an enviable start in life, his son was always going to have work. He then made a lot of money for himself as a very successful investment manager.