…You get the call saying this has happened. Two years of work on the big jump line, not a single person complaining to us, at an ‘official’ spot. When I turned up last night, trees have been ripped out in order to get a digger in and all sorts of mess has been made. Not quite sure what to do.
Council owned land in stoke on trent but there has been a bike park here for quite some time now. I can only assume its insurance related, I’m going to send some emails and make some calls today.

Guess back to work eh?

And an old pic for reference

In their defense, it was hardly inconspicuous.

It was in a part of the woods that hardly even walked through too.

only assume its insurance related

Did you have specific permission to build those jumps in that location? If not, then it was probably only a matter of time TBH, councils are (perhaps understandably) reasonably risk averse.

You could always build the replacment on your own lawn instead?

As much as you may like it, if it’s someone else’s property and you’ve no permission it’s vandalism in the same way spray painting pretty pictures or smashing windows is.

I assuming the one near the ski centre ending in pool? ‘king ****.
There was no logging done just your jumps flattened?

Oh those under-funded councils and the important work they have to do…
Imagine how quickly they destroyed all the carefully crafted jumps. Job satisfaction at it’s highest.

it’s vandalism in the same way spray painting pretty pictures or smashing windows is.

:facepalm: Nope, no it isn’t. I’m not going to argue further with anyone over this as I know it’s pointless but I really don’t get this opposition to creating great lines for people to enjoy in areas which previously weren’t being used. Not everyone wants to bimble along all the time. You wouldn’t get this on a BMX forum, I can never understand why some (majority? or the most vocal?) MTB’ers are such narrow minded fun killing wazzocks?

OP – I feel your pain, especially coming into Summer when all the hard work over Winter should be paying off in riding great lines. If you’re ever up near Preston drop me a line.

Clearly some people with high self opinions on here already.

Jekkyl- correcto.
Dezb- Indeed.

Its really infuriating, so many hours poured into it. Helping locals lads stay away from ‘spray painting or smashing windows’ The location is a well know spot for antisocial behaviour from chavs, doggers and all sorts. They could have done something about that first, but nope. Just pick on the bikers as per. You regularly see MX bikes about and they never do anything about that.

Steve, I’ll bare that in mind. New places are always good! Too add to your point, guess people are jelly because they couldn’t ride them perhaps?

Ta.

All the woodwork including ladder drops and a hut have been cut down in the woods local to me. They have filled in some doubles apparently too. I can understand why it’s been done but it’s still gutting as they were some of the best features.

I really don’t get this opposition to creating great lines for people to enjoy in areas which previously weren’t being used… I can never understand why some (majority? or the most vocal?) MTB’ers are such narrow minded fun killing wazzocks?

I don’t think it’s ‘some MTBers being fun killing wazzocks’, and I can completely see why it’s a shame that all that hard work has gone to waste, but:
1 – It seems like there was no permission for it, so they’re totally entitled to knock them down. OP – you say ‘official’, what made it official?
2 – They’re great lines to you, but to a council worker or risk assessor the thought process goes that “this is something that a local kid is going to do themselves a mischief on: If that happens, their parents are going to sue the council for allowing the jumps to be there. Conclusion – knock down the jumps”. While, as I say, that’s a shame, I can see both sides of it. Looking at the pics, I wouldn’t want to ride those (I know I can’t jump for toffee), so a council fella with no MTB experience is going to see them as a court case waiting to happen.

There’s a bunch of places where unofficial park lines have become official by contact and negotiation with local authorities, forestry commission etc. Maybe jumps have had to be smaller, maybe they’ve had to be checked over, maybe they’ve had to be tabletops rather than gaps, but maybe that’s better than seeing your hard work torn down. Building stuff out of the way and hoping no-one notices always seems like a recipe for it getting ripped down as-and-when they do.

OP – I hope your emails and calls are fruitful,good luck with it.

The spot was made official a few years back and the council granted £10000 for the trails.

Nothing has changed as far as I’m aware, people just stopped using the older features and they got taken down due to lack of use around 3 years ago. I started up here around 2 years back and its all been good until now even with last years jump line and lots of big stuff.

Just pick on the bikers as per

again, did you have specific permission to build those jumps in that location..?

You regularly see MX bikes about and they never do anything about that.

…That I’m aware of (is what you meant to add to that, right?

Nothing has changed as far as I’m aware

Cross posts, so that’s a No then I take it? Go and talk to the council, do the meeting thing, get them onside, they’ll probably even help you to rebuild them

Clearly some people with high self opinions on here already.

I dunno if they actually mean it. They’re just programmed by years on the internet and STW in particular to come out with guff like that.
I couldn’t ride those jumps, but I’m full of admiration for those who can and particularly those who put the work in to create them. To call it a form of vandalism is pathetic and short-sighted, like some frumpy old octogenarian sat in his drawing room chair, with f-all else to moan about.

The last session

They look great, I’m not surprised they knocked them down though.

The spot was made official a few years back and the council granted £10000 for the trails.

On that basis, it sounds most likely the trails are outside of what they agreed/expected and coms have broken down between the point of “this is what we want too build” and “in the diggers go”. I’d guess* the council expected bimbly stuff then “found” jumps.

To call it a form of vandalism is pathetic and short-sighted,

Sounds like it’s not relevant here any way given the above.

Imagine it’s your land.You know about it and turn a blind eye,leaving them to it.Someone nosedives head first into a landing and breaks their neck leaving them quadraplegic.They don’t want to sue you as they help dig the spot but they are now facing a lifetime of round the clock care that has to be paid for.
How would you pay for the likely multi million pound legal claim against you.
I have put in thousands of hours of digging at multiple riding spots over the last 25 years.And have done so knowing full well they are temporary and run the risk of getting flattened at any time.
If you don’t want it to happen.Find some land,enter an agreement with the landowner,secure the site and form a club so you can take out limited liability insurance (with your name on the papers).This is what the legitimate bmx trail spots have had to do to survive.
Also…’MTB’ers are such narrow minded fun killing wazzocks?’.Are you 12?

if the council paid for the jumps and the council paid someone to remove them you’d best speak to the council to find out why they were removed. That way you might gain some understanding as to what can be done in future.

If the council didn’t directly fund the jumps then you’ve nothing to complain about. You took a chance to build unsanctioned stuff and it got removed. if you want to build stuff to last you need to do as Rorschach says above.

I know of a ‘jump line’ that was created deep in some woods in Scotland, with similar ‘ooh, we are not hurting anyone’ approach.
Unfortunately the jumpers did not realise that they were in a conservation area, that had really, really rare fungi and woodland flowers that had been part of a decade long study into them.
I think the jumps look great – but experience says you *have* to engage formally with councils and landowners, or you will have them flattened or issues arise.

A shame for all that conversation and practical approach was not organised.

We had an agreement with FC for the dirt jumps at Delamere.As long as they did’nt get too big,did’nt dig pits for material and did’nt cut down trees then they would accept liability under their own insurance.
Of course people dug a new big line using cut down trees and material from 5ft deep pits.
They rightly bulldozed everything.

Jack

Get on to the council and find out the score.

Whatever you do, stay calm and do not get dragged into argument.

Now days it is all about trail management, get in touch with people that manage trails and find out what permissions and signage etc are required to make a trail or line truly ‘official’.

You are the future of MTB and need to think about what and how you do things in a different way. The days of digging lines and expecting them to survive have gone.

Good luck and make the new ‘official’ line even better.

Always a shame when jump lines or trails get the official treatment Jack.

Several years back i helped build an almighty jump spot. It had the lot and was made from god’s own golden/red clay. 6 months it took us and shortly after the final line was complete and we were all getting our groove on, that welsh trailbuilding chap was given a tour (along with a local member of the council). The following week the diggers rolled up. After much protesting the council built their own jumps in the same area. Much less gooder and costing the tax payer over £80k.

My local jump spot has been going for over 25 years. Part of the reason it’s lasted is we started filling the the gaps on the bigger (i.e taller) doubles to make them look less dangerous. It’s a complete illusion but seems to work and allows the less experienced guys to have a go.

I might suggest rebuilding somewhere in the church. Plenty of room, plenty steep in places and you could hide the line away past some undergrowth.

Sorry your line got dug up, especially if you had permission for them.

I fear the same thing is going to happen at our ‘local spot’. There have been MTB trails there for years, 10 or more I think, but they were always subtle, tucked away in dark corners of the woods and they were just that – trails, you couldn’t really knock them down as there was nothing to knock down, all the jumps and drops were made using natural features – the council isn’t going to deforest a huge area just to dig up a massive rock that’s been there since the dinosaurs roamed the land that some people are riding their bikes off.

3 years ago someone started building the odd jump, tiny to start only maybe 30cm high, couple of dead branches with soil over them, then there was a well-made timber made jump, 2 years ago they progressed to doubles and trail gaps, massive ones. They’ve been incredibly busy this winter just gone – there are trails everywhere, it’s either a big team or they’re very busy I have to doff my cap, it’s all well-made, not kids messing around and they leave nothing behind, no litter, no shady half-finished jumps without landings, but it’s the scale of them – if you’ve ever been to the mini-bike park on top of Afan it’s roughly the same scale as what they’ve built there or more, certainly no smaller.

I’m not sure how long before an irate non-mtb wood users comes along and kicks up a fuss about someone taking over the whole wood, or the number of people there – for a shady ‘hidden’ thing, there were more people there a few weeks ago on a weds evening than were at Cwmcarn the week after.

If you need further council related advice – have a chat with John Dallow at Sheffield City Council. There’s an officially sanctioned, and pretty bloody obvious jump spot not far from me with some real big ass scary stuff, that he’s behind (as well as all the Lady Canning & Radmires stuff). He should be able to help with what needs to be done to keep officialdom happy, and also as an example of acceptable and on-going practice.

Also…’some MTB’ers are such narrow minded fun killing wazzocks?’.Are you 12?

41 going on 12, I really ought to grow up and get a proper bike and a beard and suchlike. But mainly I just wanted to use the word “wazzock”.

41 going on 12, I really ought to grow up and get a proper bike and a beard and suchlike. But mainly I just wanted to use the word “wazzock”.

You do have a woodburner though?