I don’t like single pivot dogs 😆

Scrotes shouldn’t be allowed to burgle your house, but do you leave your door unlocked because in an ideal world the law would prevent them from doing so?

Analogy not quite right. Correct analogy would be intruder enters your house while you are sat in the lounge. Are you expecting every house owner to be trained in dealing with it, would they know what the right course of action is etc,. Is it the home owners responsibility to learn close combat, knife defense, gun defense etc,. ?

Analogy not quite right. Correct analogy would be intruder enters your house while you are sat in the lounge. Are you expecting every house owner to be trained in dealing with it, would they know what the right course of action is etc,. Is it the home owners responsibility to learn close combat, knife defense, gun defense etc,. ?

What if the home owner owns a combat poodle?

sorry, but disagree.

Your analogy is the equivalent of being attacked by a dog; what is being advocated is sensible action to reduce the chances.

In analogy-land, the would-be thief is outside your house as we speak. Does he see and hear signs of activity or does the house look empty apart from that window that’s been left slightly open?

Well this was on the BBC twitter feed this morning. Dog attack powers ‘not being used’

Is it the home owners responsibility to learn close combat, knife defense, gun defense etc,. ?

They might have a better chance of keeping their stuff and not taking a beating if they did!

drlex – Member
The simple thing to do is to start a civil claim, the criminal sanction will be minor
A simple “letter before action” as a starter for ten, it will tease out whether the owner has insurance or not

…is what I’d be doing in the OP’s (lightly-nibbled) shoes.

Incidentally, household contents insurance can sometimes respond to this sort of claim, so there doesn’t necessarily have to be a specific ‘pet insurance’ policy in place.

Your analogy is the equivalent of being attacked by a dog; what is being advocated is sensible action to reduce the chances

Exactly. People like TJ are so blind with barely intelligent fury they will not be able to accept that.

Nope. You are part of the problem because you continue to fail to understand that it is the dog owners responsibility to control their dog and not the responsibility of the person being attacked.

How do you get to that from what I’ve written I genuinely dont understand.
Bloke bitten by dog, I recommend chasing it up with police again and advise trying to get police to establish if owner has 3rd party insurance as most pet insurance does, another person gives advice on how to minimise risk by stopping, the whole world seems to implode and then I’m all but accused of having a dog that bites…I dont get it.

What I don’t get is why people on here, not necessarily you, cant seem to separate out the idiot owners of dogs and someone who tries to give some friendly advice on here.
My dog has never chased a bike or a runner and yet just because I own a dog I’m part of the problem.

How do you get to that from what I’ve written I genuinely don’t understand.

Nope, me neither. But I’ve not read the whole thread(s) in detail, and I’m not going to go back through to find out who said what when and where things started getting tetchy! 🙂

Slightly off topic but could someone recommend me a dog? Since I’m not legally allowed to carry anything to protect myself and my family from dog attacks and since there seems to be little or no legal repercussions from using a dog to injure or intimidate people I figure I might as well arm myself accordingly.

“Woof?”

What I don’t get is why people on here, not necessarily you, cant seem to separate out the idiot owners of dogs and someone who tries to give some friendly advice on here.

In no way excusing the owner, obviously it is there responsibility to control the dog, but does this ever happen to people that are not scared of dogs? It would appear that ‘not knowing how to behave around dogs’ is a thing. Not the fault of the ‘victim’ in any way, but it does seem to be a common cause.

In principle I agree, but in practice I favour the Big Stick approach rather than the ‘not being scared of dogs ‘ and ‘knowing how to behave around dogs’ approach. How about the dogs getting the ‘Knowing how to behave around humans’ thing and the ‘If I bite a human bad things happen’ thing?

Not the fault of the ‘victim’ in any way, but it does seem to be a common cause.

1) They are actually a victim, not a “victim”.
2) By stating this is the ’cause’, rather than a small factor – you are victim shaming… again…
3) Yes – being aware of how dogs might behave is really sensible and is perhaps why I am never bitten, but to put any onus at all on young kids to behave in a certain “correct” way because a scary beast owned by a muppet hasn’t been trained properly is evading the issue.

How about the dogs getting the ‘Knowing how to behave around humans’ thing and the ‘If I bite a human bad things happen’ thing?

Yeah that’ll work.

You hit a dog with a stick today, and it will be straight into docktrackworld.com spreading the word to all the other dogs.

Until they all hear about it though, I’ll carry on using common sense.

to put any onus at all on young kids to behave in a certain “correct” way because a scary beast owned by a muppet hasn’t been trained properly is evading the issue.

at the risk of this thread turning exactly into the other one…..

to put any onus at all on young kids to cross the road carefully way because a car owned by a muppet isn’t being driven[/u] properly is evading the issue.

No-one is disputing or evading the issue that cars should be driven carefully; but by comparison are you saying that teaching children road sense is not sensible?

It is possible to do both without one degrading the other.

theotherjonv: I absolutely agree with you.

But you see one apologist here, whilst saying that, casting doubt on whether bitten people are victims and suggests they are partly the cause. Another one caliing people who disagree a dumb shit, and one on the other thread calling the OP a prick.

Nice…

whether bitten people are victims and suggests they are partly the cause

This is where to me, as a dog lover and owner, but also a pragmatist, I find to be the greyest of areas.

If an inquisitive but ‘well meaning’ dog runs up to you, and you follow the ‘recommended advice’ and ignore it (turn away and don’t look at it, tuck hands away, say ‘off!’ if it jumps at you) then there’s a fair chance the dog and / or owner will realise you aren’t interested and leave you alone or call it away or put it on a lead.

If the same dog with the same intention comes up to you and you push it away with feet or hands, or run away, or wave your arms and scream, then it might react differently (as may the owner if you kick the dog / shove a stick up its arse)

I AM IN NO WAY SAYING THAT THE DOG SHOULDN’T RUN UP TO YOU IN THE FIRST PLACE, OR THAT THE OWNER SHOULDN’T BE ABLE TO DEAL WITH IT APPROPRIATELY but in one situation above you have really done all you can to avoid something bad happening; in the other you haven’t. It doesn’t make it your fault, but the greyness is whether you could have acted differently to give yourself a better chance of a better outcome. Is that so hard for some to accept at the same time as saying that if the dog hadn’t run up in the first place it wouldn’t matter either way.

Analogy fail – you teach kids road sense in order to keep them safe because otherwise they might get hurt even if all cars are being driven properly.

Though I do find it interesting that the car analogy is being used – cars and roads are another area where many owners have a sense of entitlement, and lack any sense of responsibility towards the more vulnerable.

Another one caliing people who disagree a dumb shit

No I called you that because you said I was one of the problem owners based on nothing more than your own stupidity and prejudice.

Though I do find it interesting that the car analogy is being used – cars and roads are another area where many owners have a sense of entitlement, and lack any sense of responsibility towards the more vulnerable

And just like car threads all the drivers/dog owners on STW are awesome

Let’s first start by all realising that not everyone wants a dog running up to them and sniffing/pawing/playing with them, or even just being friendly. They may have had a horrendous experience in the past/

Let’s then move to dog owners accepting that and training their dogs, or selecting appropriate breeds, or deciding not to own a dog.

Finally, let’s see dog owners when the dog has misbehaved, proactively apologising, and not saying “he never normallly does that”.

In the meantime teaching people to deal with dogs is really sensible, but let’s not blame them for faling to adopt a defensive posture, or pretend they aren’t victims. I get to see a fair few people bitten by dogs. They are.

Can we agree on that?

Analogy fail – you teach kids road sense in order to keep them safe because otherwise they might get hurt even if all cars are being driven properly.

Yes, you’re right. To an extent. I could equally argue that if cars were being driven properly then they should be able to predict all potential scenarios and able to react to them (able to stop in time, etc.) The driving test now includes hazard scenario stuff does it not?

But that would be nit picking, and realistically we don’t really disagree with each other’s PoV, do we?

AA In the past few days other people have pointed out to you your misunderstandings and logical errors, and once again you have failed to read what other people said. Nowhere did I say you were a problem owner. I said the attitude you were displaying here was that we see with some dog owners and part of the problem. And by repeating your angry playground insult you don’t help your argument that you aren’t.

You have, incidentally, acted as a great test of just how TJ has changed his approach.

Not sure any minds are going to be changed here. Hope the OP got everything sorted.

I don’t think we do – but sometimes nit picking is fun 😉

AA In the past few days other people have pointed out to you your misunderstandings and logical errors,

Really where?

I said the attitude you were displaying here was that we see with some dog owners and part of the problem

Where have I displayed this attitude, show me an example? I suggested the op press the police to act and when someone else made some suggestions on how to act around dogs and TJ started on at him I pointed out that TJ obviously had miss read the op.
And all of this means I’m part of the problem how?

You are just reading what you want to read or assuming I have made posts I havent. That seems pretty stupid on your part and insulting to me. If you dont like that I couldnt really care.

Depends whose nits are being picked

😀

STW earlier

and one on the other thread calling the OP a prick

Yes, because by that point he was acting like one. Just as many are right now in many threads across STW.

It’s not about dialectic discourse, it’s about who’s right and who affirms the view of the echo chamber on here, quite frankly I don’t know why anyone bothers trying to have a reasonable discussion as within no time at all people are labeling you an “apologist” and worse.

I’ve just witnessed a man on an e bike that he didn’t need to pedal with a bull terrier on a lead riding one handed up a hill.
How much hate is there for just that one person?
And he wasn’t wearing a helmet.

Odd winner emerging here – cats and they’re ‘orrible

angeldust

Exactly. People like TJ are so blind with barely intelligent fury they will not be able to accept that.

sorry dude – I am not angry , I do yunderstand your point. Its you that in you closed mind don’t understand mine and others point. If you actually listened to others and opened your closed mind you might develop some empathy for those like me that don’t want to be bothered by dogs and you might stop your ridiculous victim blaming.

What you are saying is the equivalent of saying its a girls fault if she is raped because she is wearing a miniskirt.

cant seem to separate out the idiot owners of dogs

I can, mostly. The sensible owners are ones that have their dogs on a lead in public places. Through endless experience I treat every other dog as one with a irresponsible owner.

I’m not afraid of dogs (I’ve owned 2) I like dogs. I don’t however, want your dog chasing me (happens all the time) I don’t want your dog jumping up at me, (I don’t want to have to launder my clothes unnessasarily) , and I don’t want your dog to try to bite my foot as I cycle past. I don’t want to interact with your dog at all if I don’t have to.

If you’re in public; put it on a lead, other than that, do what you want (most owners seem to anyway)

I don’t however, want your dog chasing me (happens all the time) I don’t want your dog jumping up at me, (I don’t want to have to launder my clothes unnessasarily) , and I don’t want your dog to try to bite my foot as I cycle past.

If you have ever met my dog you would know she doesnt do any of those things so why keep trying to make it personal?
Ypu have also quoted me out of context, its wasnt about good v bad owners it was about idiot owners and people on here trying to help with some advice.

some empathy for those like me that don’t want to be bothered by dogs and you might stop your ridiculous victim blaming.

All he did was offer some advice, take it or leave. I cant see you ever being not bothered by dogs though. Like it or not this country has millions of them and many are owned by idiots.
I noted on another thread today you offered a cyclist advice re a close call when using a cycle lane past stationary traffic and someone turned right across him. I think this was sensible and practical good advice despite the law clearly stating the driver should check the way is clear. Is this not victim blaming too?

If you have ever met my dog you would know she doesnt do any of those things so why keep trying to make it personal

No, that’s the point, I don’t know that, by letting your dog off its lead you are abdicating your responsibility to people who don’t know your dog at all.

(ps it’s not personal, I was using a global “your” not a personal one, apologies if you didn’t get that, or I wasn’t clear)

I’ve taken to carrying varying sizes of electroshock collar with me on every ride or walk. Through years of painstaking practice (at fairgrounds on those throwing hoops on to sticks games) I am able to throw said collars with 100% accuracy.

When I encounter a rapscallion owner and dog combination, I simply launch a collar on to both and proceed to electrocute them. I only stop once the owner has soiled their trousers and the dog has passed out. I would suggest that you all practice this technique. It would be a damn sight simpler than following some of the other, equally stupid, advice given so far.

Any news OP?

I’m seriously thinking of inventing a dog fighting martial art. What should it be called? I’m going for Fido (like Judo), but for throwing dogs.

What you are saying is the equivalent of saying its a girls fault if she is raped because she is wearing a miniskirt.

And I thought Chewkw was a bot.

I don’t know that, by letting your dog off its lead you are abdicating your responsibility to people who don’t know your dog at all.

No I’m not when she walks past you ignoring thats all I have to do. It comes back to the other days discussion about a person having “reasonable” grounds to be scared. A dog being a dog and walking past you ignoring you is not reasonable grounds for you being scared. Obviously if you are visibly scared I would put her on the lead or hold her collar and I regularly do this but her just being present is not reasonable.

sorry dude – I am not angry , I do yunderstand your point. Its you that in you closed mind don’t understand mine and others point. If you actually listened to others and opened your closed mind you might develop some empathy for those like me that don’t want to be bothered by dogs and you might stop your ridiculous victim blaming.

But you are going to be bothered by dogs, because lots of people don’t control them all that well. These same people don’t feel that they should have to keep their dogs to the level of control you wish they would, just because you choose to ride a bike in the same space they walk their dogs. I don’t expect you to be able to comprehend this. That’s the real world I’m afraid, people are intolerant and inconsiderate arses. Do you think you can do anything to change that? If people ridicule your thoughts on here, how far do you think you will get in the real world? Might be easier to take 10 seconds to let them get control of their dog, maybe give it a pat, and ride on with a smile on your face. Works for me.

What you are saying is the equivalent of saying its a girls fault if she is raped because she is wearing a miniskirt.

That’s just silly. Getting a bit desperate now. In terms of your analogy, what I am saying is yes, a girl should be able to wear a miniskirt anywhere she likes without receiving unwanted attention (or worse). In the real world there are situations where the mere action of putting a slightly longer skirt on is just sensible if you want to go about your business without being bothered. For example, a lone tourist girl on holiday in Egypt would be very wise to do so, unless she was trying to prove a point and was prepared for the consequences. Shouldn’t be like that, but it is. Back to bikes and dogs – Do you want an easy/happy life, or stick to your principles and fight little battles you are never going to win? There are always going to be situations where people don’t control their dogs very well, and where girls in short skirts get unwanted attention.

No I’m not when she walks past you ignoring thats all I have to do. It comes back to the other days discussion about a person having “reasonable” grounds to be scared. A dog being a dog and walking past you ignoring you is not reasonable grounds for you being scared. Obviously if you are visibly scared I would put her on the lead or hold her collar and I regularly do this but her just being present is not reasonable.

Seems totally reasonable to me.

Sadly though this is a minority case IME.

a person having “reasonable” grounds to be scared

I’m not scared, I just don’t want to interact with other people’s dogs and I don’t see why I should have to, just keep it on a lead, it solves 100% of unwanted dog interactions guaranteed every time, the fact that dog owners resist this speaks volumes about their sense of entitlement

I think it’s probably unresolvable tbh, most dog owners can’t see the issue, and I’m bored of having to try to explain it to them