I’m trying to decide which of two bikes to choose. One is large (20″) and the other medium (18″). Should be easy right? But I’m finding it tricky to decide which I prefer. I’m 6′ tall with 32″ inside leg by the way.

I’ve heard it said that larger is better for climbing and smaller for descending, but I’m finding the opposite. I can chuck the smaller frame around a bit more which helps on steep technical climbs. But when I try to get in the attack position for a descent it feels like I’m too far forward on the smaller frame, so I move back into a more defensive position, which makes it harder to attack the trail. With the larger bike I feel more comfortable with my weight near the middle of the bike going down. However, I’ve only been riding off road for a year so I wonder whether (if and when I ever improve) I’m likely to prefer the smaller bike for descending in future too or whether it’s just a personal preference thing and some folk really prefer descending on a larger frame.

A bigger bike will be more stable, longer wheelbase. Partly why DH bikes have long wheelbases in general.

I feel a smaller bike is easier to move around, hence my DH bike is 15″ (and I’m 5’10”)

Height is not a useful measurement on its own. The right size bike will ride better up and down. It may be that the medium is too small for you. Where are you buying from?

i am loads comfier descending on a bigger bike, i just wish bike companies would make larger dh type frames.

Thanks. Maybe it is just a personal preference thing then (as we have one person preferring smaller and one larger).

This isn’t actually a purchasing decision as such. For reasons I wont bore you with I’ve ended up with two FS bikes. I don’t need both but can’t decide which to sell and don’t want to get rid of one based on how I’m riding now only to find that I’d prefer the other in a years time. I have seriously considered putting them both up for sale and just seeing which one goes first!

I am a similar height/inside leg and I feel best on a large/20″ frame than a 18″ both up and down.

>This isn’t actually a purchasing decision as such. For reasons I wont bore you with I’ve ended up with two FS bikes. I don’t need both but can’t decide which to sell and don’t want to get rid of one based on how I’m riding now only to find that I’d prefer the other in a years time.<

Congratulations! You are the STW identikit rider – keep them both 😉

Seriously, you’re the one riding them – just ditch the one you like the least. Simple.

If you get the smaller bike you’ll have to fit a longer stem for the xc stuff which will ruin any pretensions of downhill handling.

I think the idea of smaller frames for DH has gone out of the window a bit – it all kind of stems back to the days of massive standover heights. If the bike has a reputation as a capable descender then just get the right size.

You”ll feel like you’re much more “in”a bigger bike rather than “on”

what are the bikes?

keep the red one, its faster

I find a bigger bike (longer wheelbase) better on flat out decents where you need stability. But when it gets slower and more technical (thinking off camber with slippy roots etc) I prefer a smaller frame so I can balance it and throw it around a bit better.

I hate climbing on any bike 😉

Paul

If you already own both bikes, surely you can tell which you prefer riding better than us?

You’d think so wouldn’t you 🙂 Actually, I can say which I prefer for a given section of the trail. As I said, I prefer descending on the larger bike. But since this goes against conventional wisdom I just wanted to check whether anybody else felt the same.

Of course, none of this helps with the larger question of which bike to keep. One of the joys of mountain biking is the sheer variety of riding so it stands to reason that no one bike will be best everywhere. Also, if I’m honest, I have an emotional attachment to the smaller bike (2006 Orange Five), which I don’t feel for the larger one (2012 Giant Trance) and that probably makes it harder for me to accept that the larger bike is a better fit.

theres also the fact that the trance has a decent suspension action which will help no end on the downs

the five will climb well as in the small ring it practically locks out.

Is that right ? I’ve not heard many Five owners complaining that they are crap on the descents 🙂 Also, I thought the suspension was optimum in the middle ring (36T). But what you are saying does fit with my experiences. If I’m climbing at the limit of my ability in the (22T) granny ring it does feel fantastically solid. Going down I find the Trance feels more solid and stiffer, but then I’m probably not pushing the Five hard enough for it to shine.

not saying the 5 is a bad decender and imo its a great allrounder if you can stay out the granny

but the trance is a cracking bike for decending if a little heavy for what it is. i like maestro link bikes , anthem rides like a much longer travel bike than it is on the downs

which makes it harder to attack the trail

Eh? I’ve only attacked the trail after I’ve crashed and am venting my frustration…

Trances are short bikes, Fives are long ones.

Measure the top tubes and see how they compare.

I’m sure I read an interview with Nico Vouilloz in DIRT where he comments that he is using a large (Lapierre Spicy?) rather than a medium for enduro racing as he finds it’s more stable on the descents.

Nico is a god so it must be true… but as a above ride what feels best 😀

If you get the smaller bike you’ll have to fit a longer stem for the xc stuff which will ruin any pretensions of downhill handling.

and if you get a bigger bike with a teeny tiny stem your weight may end up too far forward on steep climbs, ie your shoulders are further forward than your hands – wrist strain. Depends what you’re after and what compromises you’re willing to make.

or get a 19″ frame with a medium length stem 🙂

The difference in effective top tube is only 2cm (61cm vs 59cm) but it feels quite different. Mind you, the giant has a longer stem as well, which probably makes as big a difference (100mm vs 75mm if I remember correctly) 😳

I am the same height and inside leg as you and was incorrectly sold a Medium Trance, sold it after a few months and got a Large which feels a much better fit. No difference in my descending times, the larger model just fits me better and feels more stable at speed. I run the large with a 60mm stem though. Ultimately, it’s going to be a personal choice. I used to think a smaller bike was more ‘chuckable’ when I bought it, but it seems current trend is for shorter stems for trail ridng, which compliments the larger frame well I think.

It’s all pretty complicated tbh. I prefer a bike that’s well designed- so it fits me height wise, while not being too short nor too long, pedals OK upwards and bombs back down. There’s no shortage of these, so I’ve never felt an urge to buy one the wrong size 😉

I’m also in the throws of do I need a larger frame. I’m 6’4″, 33″ inside leg, arms like a baboon. I’m riding and loving an 18″ Sanderson Soloist. I really should be on a 20″ if not a 22″ (20″ is the biggest). I’ve “measured” a 20″ frame up against my bike. It will change things a tiny bit. BB drops by about 5mm, top tube length increases by about 20mm, which would be moot because I’d need a short stem so I could reach the bars comfortably.

I always thought that a larger bike was better pointing down, more stability, but the Sanderson is muddying my theories. It’s either what feels right to you or it maybe that the Sanderson is a far more “sorted” bike than what I’ve had before.

I have a friend same size as you who went for the XL Trance to get the length he wanted.

Swap the stems over and see what you think of the Orange then.

Ah, back in the days when we had proper standards that would indeed have been the thing to do. But the Trance uses Giants new Overdrive 2 (non)standard 🙄 I might try and find a longer stem though, just to see how it feels.

I’m the same size as OP and went for a large (20″) anthem over the medium (18″) mainly because it felt a lot more stable on fast descents but it was noticeably more difficult to wheelie/manual than the medium and its hard to get my weight as far back as i’d like on steep stuff. However it climbs like a beast and feels more stable on singletrack so i’m happy. I did fit a slightly shorter stem though.

On the length of bike for descending issue… It’s more of a wheelbase Vs cockpit length issue than a long bike Vs short bike one.

You’ll find DH bikes for instance have quite short cockpit length, but very long wheelbases. A steep, head down arse up race hardtail will have a long cockpit length, but a relatively short wheelbase. This is largely driven by the bikes designated use, but will be easy to spot in the geometry. For instance, your Orange 5 whilst shorter in the TT, possibly has a longer wheelbase than the Giant.

Still doesn’t explain why you prefer the Giant to the Orange. Too many other deciding factors! What I will say though is riding the bike that feels most comfortable, and you enjoy riding, is far more conducive to enjoyment than keeping the bike that has some emotional pull but you feel doesn’t fit you quite right.

And that’s all without going into the inherent ins and outs of both suspension designs… Personally, I’d keep the Giant and maybe fit a slightly shorter stem to it in your position. But that’s just my opinion.

OK, I’ll do that then. Anyone want to buy a Five 🙂

Seriously, thanks, you are probably right. The Trance does seem to fit me better although I’m less convinced now that it’s just a frame size issue. I took the Five out for a night ride last night and had a play about with different positions on the bike. It’s quite interesting when you can’t really see the front wheel and just go by feel. I found that if I bent my legs more and got lower it felt better, so maybe the centre of gravity is just higher (BB is certainly a bit higher as it stands).

I reckon that, with a bit of work I could get the Five to feel as good as the Trance. But why bother when the Trance already feels good? Do I just want to keep it because it is (an) Orange?

This bike fit stuff is tricky though and I have no idea how you guys manage to judge a bike based on a short test. Although the Five doesn’t feel quite right now at various points over the past few months it has felt fantastic!

I’ve tried looking at Strava segments. They can’t lie can they? While the differences are tiny it is noticeable that on virtually every segment (up or down) my best time was set on the Trance. So, that’s conclusive then. Except that I didn’t get the Five until September so most of the Trance rides were done in the summer and most Five rides in Autumn/Winter. Man this is tough 🙂