It’s new (used) car time.

We currently have a 2.0 Zetec Diesel C-Max and being honest, it’s been a bit of a lemon. The thing is, I’ve loved the performance and economy of it but the reliability has been a concern. The worse thing is that it always seems to be some outrageously expensive modern diesel specific component that goes.

So now I’m a little put off and I’m considering going back to Petrol. I’ve had K-Series Rovers and Duratec Fords in the past and had next to no issues with them. One of the Rover popped its head gasket but I did let the coolant run dry so it’s my own fault.

One factor has been a lot of urban miles probably not helping our C-Max…

I’m thinking sub-60k mileage, £5k spend, preferably an entertaining, comfortable hatchback but otherwise a pretty open brief. Am I wrong to be leaning towards Petrol? Heart is drawn to Mini Cooper (few S models around too) but I know early models were problematic. Sensible head is thinking Civic or Fabia.

Also open to much bigger cars and left field choices. The C-Max is staying so this is a second car…

I’ve a petrol C-max (1.6), bought with 30,000 on the clock for £5k, now has 65,000 and all it’s had is 2 front tyres, 3 oil changes, filters and spark plugs and a power steering hose (which was done under warrenty).

TBH I’m not sure what I hate more, it’s boring reliability or the light metalic blue colour, does 42mpg on the motorway anf 36 on the B-roads.

Missus has a fiesta, similarly reliable, but not very practical if you’re 6ft+ (and I’m saying that as someone who used to have an MG Midget!), the wing mirrirs don’t actualy go far enough to show me much more than the door handles and the kerb! MPG’s slightly better.

If I were you I’d get a small petrol engined car, diesels really don’t like short journeys at low speeds.

All depends on how many miles you’ll be putting on it. The mention of urban miles makes me think a petrol will be better for you anyway if you’re making lots of small trips.

Small entertaining hatchbacks?
Mini has to be there even if the boot is absolutely useless.
I really like the 9N3 shape Polo Dune.
Fiesta ST is a good car.
Just-gone-shaped Civic wouldn’t be entertaining but would go on forever and nice interior, massive boot for its class etc.
Older shaped TypeR? Might not tick the comfortable box though.
Left field option… Lupo GTI? Crap boot though.
Corsa C SRI? Don’t know much about these but think they came with a 1.8 option and our old 1.2 SXI was a nice little car.
How much are Alfa Mitos?
Clio 182? Comfortable(ish) but flimsy but massively good fun.
Seat Ibiza FR/Cupra? The one with the 1.8T.
Another left field option – Smart Four4 Brabus?

If you decide diesel, I’d be all over an old shaped Fabia vRS. If we need another car then I’m getting one. Test drove one for a few hours a few years back and just a massively fun but also practical, comfortable and well built car.

A 1.8 or 2.0 petrol focus like this ?

One factor has been a lot of urban miles probably not helping our C-Max…The C-Max is staying so this is a second car…

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head with the first point; modern diesels really don’t like short trips. Also, the first time you get a DPF fault, that could be a write-off unless the car is worth a lot of money. I’ve always been a Diesel fan myself, but for this purpose i suspect you’d be much better off with a petrol.

There was a test at current fuel prices on the Telly recently. Basically if you aren’t going to drive over 20k (I think) Motorway miles per annum, the fuel differential means its not worth buying a diesel.

We have an ’02 Cooper S 50k miles. Drinks V-power like a tramp attacks cider, Heavy on tax as it’s quite a dirty engine, clutch is squeeking a bit at the mo and will probably need replacing soon. But, despite these issues, the whine from the supercharger when above 4,000rpm and the way it sticks to corners and changes direction makes up for any of these issues.

We don’t do many miles and if I was after a motorway cruiser I’d look elsewhere but I really enjoy owning ours.

Looked at Lupo GTI as my mate has one but as very ltd numbers left on the road, the ideal one never appeared in time, also the Mrs Dad works for BMW so can get parts for the Mini very cheaply.

See I’d be looking at an ’04 or later Mini which I understand had a lot of probs sorted out. There’s a really nice grey S with leather nearby with 40k on the clock and they’re asking for £4500 – barter them down to £4k and would look like a bargain to me!

I do lots of short (sub 10 mile) non-urban journeys, school runs and the like. Run a 3.0i petrol car.

It does 28mpg but only cost me £1k. It replaced a 3.5i that I had for 4 years, did 25mpg and cost me £2k.

They use a lot of fuel, but are cheap to buy (and fix) and have every toy you’ll ever need plus good stereos 🙂

And if you’ve a big problem, just ebay ’em.

I drive an Audi Diesel I’ve owned lots of diesels over the years, the MIL has a petrol Focus that I sometime drive. It’s a lot cheaper to go on a journey on out Diesel then it is her Petrol by a large margin, the Focus is also a little numb nice enough car but it’s really don’t have much poke about it.

b r – Member
I do lots of short (sub 10 mile) non-urban journeys, school runs and the like. Run a 3.0i petrol car.

It does 28mpg but only cost me £1k. It replaced a 3.5i that I had for 4 years, did 25mpg and cost me £2k.

They use a lot of fuel, but are cheap to buy (and fix) and have every toy you’ll ever need plus good stereos

And if you’ve a big problem, just ebay ’em.

And if anyone wants one, my 330i is kinda up for sale 😀

Don’t think because you had problem with your C Max you won’t with anything else… I had a £38K Audi A6 that went through 3 engines in ten months, before Audi took it back off me and gave me a full refund.

Older Mini’s are fairly troublesome, I’d get another diesel tbh. the 20kpa year + is only relevant if you’re buying a new car as the diesel variant’s are normally £1500+ over the petrol version. Road tax will be higher on a petrol too due to emissions

See I’d be looking at an ’04 or later Mini which I understand had a lot of probs sorted out. There’s a really nice grey S with leather nearby with 40k on the clock and they’re asking for £4500 – barter them down to £4k and would look like a bargain to me!

Yeah, to be fair anything less than £4.5 for an ’04 with that mileage is a good price all day long. Ours has been reliable despite being one of the early ones. Check the oil and fluids regularly etc, check it out for common problems like PAS pump, gearbox and clutch, rotten rear silencer and I reckon you’ve a nice little motor on your hands.

Think about ditching the run flats if it’s still running them, especially on the 17″ rims. they kill the drive and tram line like crazy, our’s runs std 16’s now and it’s night and day a different car!

According to the tech at the FIL’s work, they see far less problems with the supercharger model than the newer turbo model. The ‘S’ runs a different gearbox to the standard so is better apparently.

Also, apparently the face lift models after ’05 are supposed to be the one’s to aim for.

YES!
Come on br, you can’t have a car thread on here without you reccommending your 3L X-Type as the answer to everyones needs 😉

My mistake it was an ’03 plate but mileage is only 32k… looks pretty tidy to me?

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201305106699359/sort/default/usedcars/price-to/6000/maximum-mileage/up_to_60000_miles/model/cooper_s/make/mini/onesearchad/used/onesearchad/nearlynew/onesearchad/new/radius/30/postcode/bs200hx/page/1?logcode=p

Edit: part-service history – that’ll be why I expect…

YES!
Come on br, you can’t have a car thread on here without you reccommending your 3L X-Type as the answer to everyones needs

Nope. Somebody was questioning diesel or petrol, I just happen to like big petrols. And I didn’t recommend anything.

There was a test at current fuel prices on the Telly recently. Basically if you aren’t going to drive over 20k (I think) Motorway miles per annum, the fuel differential means its not worth buying a diesel.

Those studies are flawed, they assume you are only keeping your car 3 years and are buying new. People don’t shop like that for used cars generally ime.

Urban driving isn’t necessarily a problem, it’s SHORT trips (Like 1 or 2 miles to the supermarket) WITHOUT longer ones.

We do short trips (and long ones) in our petrol hybrid, I try and keep the diesel for work related longer ones.

Alfa Mito, small economical fun car, often overlooked
the 135 petrol is a peach of an engine but probably too expensive, you might get a 155 though (fast)

The new fiat panda 4×4 is supposed to be good.

After a while, I just decided to get a car I liked and not worry about the fuel type. Sure there’s genuine advantages and disadvantages to both but it wasn’t enough to dictate the choice.

amen to that! We only do 4k miles a year so doesn’t really matter what the mpg is to me.

[/quote]After a while, I just decided to get a car I liked and not worry about the fuel type. Sure there’s genuine advantages and disadvantages to both but it wasn’t enough to dictate the choice.

Have to agree with above comment. Just get whatever suits best. Generally diesel engines have more torque in the low revs then petrol ones but they do suffer from turbo lag. Petrol or diesel can be more economical depending on engine size and how & where you drive the thing.

I currently have a diesel but in all honesty i prefer a petrol engine. They rev higher, are more reliable and certainly make a better noise when puished hard.

I do mostly short journeys so went with a petrol, only get about 32mpg usually but goes over 35mpg on motorway journeys (1.8 Octavia). I’d say look at a Fabia or Octavia if you want a lot of car for your money.

Petrol for me unless I am driving all over the place everyday for long journey.

The repair bill and headache are just not worth the hassle to save a few quid if you are driving short journey or occasional driver only. I am the latter.

My friend just spent £1.2K fixing his diesel injector …

Not seen the TV thing, but doing the maths on fuel cost per mile, 20k seems to be the break point for us, we do more than that a year in the sensible car, so it’s diesel, if the wife gets the chance to work from home more,a quick petrol will cost the same to run.

For what you have described it would be petrol for me.

I drive a pre dpf era diesel. But I do c.20k pa of which at least half is freeflowing motorway driving and it gets 3 oil changes a year to allow for the effectvof the urban slog it also endures.

The diesel estate gets 30% more mpg than the petrol hatch (both mondeos) but is more fun and lighter on its tyres and brakes. petrol notably slower when loaded up.

At risk of a hijack… Out of interest what is the score with ‘longer’ journeys to avoid killing DPFs? I’m considering a new car, really like my Golf TDI, but I’m looking at sommat newer where the diesel has a DPF. I only do 6-8000 miles a year, so petrol seems to make sense. Then part of me says spending more in the first place is ok (used cars), as its a sunk cost, and having something that cost more to run on a daily basis would annoy me more. Likely to keep it 5+ years, so initial cost will probably cancel out.

Trouble is I have a nasty habit of driving 1.5 miles to the station because I’m lazy! Very rarely go near a motorway, but do at least a weekly 20 mile journey, driven reasonably hard. Would I bugger a DPF?!

Given the original thread title I’d like to add: Petrol is for cars, diesel is for vans and agricultural vehicles. Just my opinion of course 🙂

I average 3.5k miles/month. I drive a whacking great 2.9L Auto Hyundai 4×4! Love it!

At some stage I’ll chop it in for a petrol as the purchase premium/maint/reliability of a modern TDi have made me lose interest.
I’m considering the 1.2 TSI Fabia. Or maybe the 1.8 TSI 4×4 Octy. Both chain cam AFAIK. No DPF. Not sure about disastrous DMF tho’.

Manufacturers have sold diesels based on EU road test data that is a result of very fragile componentry.

I have driven a 2l diesel fora year and a half now as i do around 20000 miles a year, its now for sale and im looking at a petrol again, i do around 50% motor way 40% urban and althought the motorway miles i get 60mpg my urban half that and i was better of in my old 1.6 306, parts seem to be cheaper for petrol cars and they seem to be easier to work on your self, plus as i’m not towing anything anymore i don’t need the torque low down.

Mikertroid – Skoda keep sending me leaflets about the Fabia Monte Carlo Tech 1.2 tsi. Sounds good value. Will try to find leaflet and post price.

Rachel

made me lose interest.
I’m considering the 1.2 TSI Fabia. Or maybe the 1.8 TSI 4×4 Octy

Are these turbo petrol engines proving reliable ? I’m assuming the worst and that a turbo would bring a whole raft of potential problems muddying the waters between petrol and diesel further. Am I wrong to be too concerned when considering these small turbo petrol engines as a second hand buy in the future?

Old diesels would run and run with little maintenance. Getting the specific power output and low emissions of a modern diesel is complicated with the engines being under much more stress and everything being designed to much tighter tolerances. The turbos, intercoolers, direct injection, DPFs, dual mass flywheels and so on add a lot of complexity and potential maintenance bills. The new breed of DI turbo petrols may suffer similar maintenance costs though to a lesser degree because the cylinder pressures are lower, the reciprocating masses smaller and the fuel much cleaner so less smoothing/cleaning add-ons are required.

I’m driving a Honda 2.0 v-tec. Not the most economical or the torquiest but the drivetrain has had nothing but plugs, oil and filter changes for the past 10 years and 120,000 miles.

I average 3.5k miles/month. I drive a whacking great 2.9L Auto Hyundai 4×4! Love it!

I’m considering the 1.2 TSI Fabia

Mate, no way will you buy something so small, after something so big – go for a test drive…

I’ve got a Golf 1.4TSi 122bhp company car. I haven’t heard anything bad about these (and the engine is a peach) but I have heard the versions in a higher state of tune and with twin turbos have suffered, accelerated bore wear I think, worse in hot countries apparently according to good ole Honest John.

Will be giving it back and getting an S Max soon, have been deliberating about petrol vs diesel but have decided on a 2.5T petrol. Possibly not my wisest ever decision but I do about 15k a year and balls to it, I just fancy one. The 5 pot Volvo motor is supposed to be bombproof. 2-3k cheaper than an equivalent diesel too and that buys a fair bit of petrol.

The worse thing is that it always seems to be some outrageously expensive modern diesel specific component that goes.

Like our Touran as well…
Boring, but I have been thinking about the new Avensis model for avoiding all this.
Honest John:

In TR trim, the 1.8i Valvematic Multidrive S comes in at £21,565 compared to £21,525 for the 2.0 D-4D.

It’s thirstier, it emits more CO2, it’s not as tax efficient, but compared to the purgatory of the 2.0 D-4D it’s a real joy to drive. The lighter weight over its front wheels helps the steering to come alive. The sweet shifting 6-ratio CVT responds pleasantly to the paddles. You feel in total control.

And, whether you buy it now or at 3 years old, the 1.8 Valvematic MTS is the sort of car it makes sense to own.

It doesn’t have a diesel particulate filter or a dual mass flywheel or an EGR or a timing belt or a turbo. Any or all of which can lead to tears between the 3rd and 6th years of car’s life.

It pumps out a healthy 145PS and 180Nm torque. Enough to get it from 0-60 in 10.1 seconds and on to a top speed of 124mph. While emitting 153g/km CO2 and 42.8mpg.

Yeah, think of the money I’ll save in tyre wear in my 260bhp front wheel drive MPV! Watch me justify this to myself!

Mate, no way will you buy something so small, after something so big – go for a test drive…

I swap between 17 seat Transit LWB buses, our Touran and my daily drive the Yaris. Just done 340 mile trip up to Peterhead and back via Inverness and Aberlour in the Yaris, and it was fine.

I’ve seen a few 1.4 non-TSi Fabias with nice spec so I’m getting very tempted by that. Reliabiltiy reports seem to be good too? I think they look smart, if a fraction bland I guess. My current ‘head’ choice anyway…

That said, I’ve just spotted a really tidy Volvo V50 1.8 petrol!