In the market for a power meter for my son who races road as a second year Junior. Must be Ant+ and the cheaper the better.

Looking at Stages (which will require a new 105 or Ultegra chainset) or Rotor LT which will not. Any experience with either or possibly Garmin Vectors would be appreciated.

Thanks

I would avoid stages, Most of the people i know that have had them have had problems with them.

Battery drain mostly

I’m on my 3rd stages due to battery drain issues. If I have to change the battery every couple of days on this one then I’ll be getting a refund and putting the money towards something else.

you would be better off getting him a coach

if he has a coach ask him for rider feedback and his view

power meters without direction in how to use them (i.e. a coach) are expensive toys

Sit tight for a couple of months and get a 4iiii Precision? Cheaper than Stages. Or Watteam PowerBeat.

Already has a coach and uses static watt bike regularly for power testing as part of development programme, but next step is riding to power output in training and races.

Anyone have any experience of Rotor LT?

+1 not stages

all my mates with them have had problems.

I’ve a Power2Max, a PowerTap and a Vector. I’d not get one of the newer PowerTaps. I like the P2M but it is sort of tied to a Rotor chainset, fine for me as it’s permanently on the TT bike. Only had the Vector about a month and I’m really liking it so far, though may be a pain if he’s not using Look pedals currently.

If you can hold out I’d say wait for the 4iiii too, should be able to just stick it to whatever chainset you have on the bike.

Rotor are great, I’ve got one on loan at the mo. Matches up to my Powertap, but do factor in the cost of chainrings and BB too. Big fan.

Sorry, just read back my post and didn’t mean to be dismissive of feedback on stages – thanks.

Not sure waiting a couple of months for 4iiii precision is an option in view of timing of race programme – that time period is glacial for a 17 year old!

Schmiken, is it the LT you have? This is favourite at the moment and we hope to be able to put existing chainrings on it.

BB is BB30 at present and I understand the LT comes with a universal convertor thingy?

Hire one for the rest of winter and revisit the question in 3-6 months?

I’ve had a P2M for about a year and a half, zero issues and power readings always seem totally plausible, battery lasted about 4000-5000 miles. P2M had some of the old style going very cheap with BB30 chainsets but not sure they’ve got any left. Bank transfer is the only pain.

I bought one of the P2M on FSA cranks as I wanted 110BCD to be able to use on the CX bike. Paid with paypal as differences between that and transfer fees were in favour of paypal.
Think it was ca. £630 with a set of 36/52 rings.

Yep, using an LT in tandem with a PowerTap. You may need a new BB, can’t remember off the top of my head if it will slot straight in, I just assumed you had external BB!

Also have a P2M which has been good so far. Not got another meter but numbers seem to compare well to a friends stages I tried for comparison.

Don’t buy a bloody left side only PM. If you’re buying a powermeter pay that bit extra for something that will give you actual reliable data. Stages etc are a compromise, and not a cheap one at that.

I’d suggest something like a 2nd hand Quarq, I’ve been very happy with mine over the past few years.

Cheers, Rich

Second hand wired SRM

Got a couple of p2ms having had ergomo before and used srm. Still rate it. In comparison to the old ergomo it is a doddle to set up. I’ve always steered clear of powertap because of the reliance on you using the same wheel.

I’m sure if there is a coach on the scene you’ll know this already but in road racing (rather than time trail) the real time data is next to useless in races. If that’s the power you need to put out to stay in the break/peleton, that’s the power – you can’t look at the numbers and back off like you can in a tt. Afterwards the numbers are useful but only if you know someone who knows what they mean or can understand them yourself. I never found the info as useful for road race training as I did tt/tri training. Make sure the head unit can calculate and display normalised power though – probably the most useful (imho) number on the road, especially when riding in groups where you don’t have much control of the pace/effort or you are riding in hills.

I’ve got 3 stages only had a problem with one & that was warrantied within a week. Ignore the nonsense that’s spouted about one sided power readings. And that above is wrong, chapter 12 of the Allen & Coggan power bible is called ‘racing faster with a power meter’

And that above is wrong, chapter 12 of the Allen & Coggan power bible is called ‘racing faster with a power meter’

I’m guessing you have read it- sadly still sits on my bedside table. There’s a reason it’s not called ‘training and road racing with a power meter’ – a fair old chunk of it is devoted to tt/tri because they are so useful in that environment. Didn’t say they were of no use, just a lot less useful and stand by the real time figures not being relevant to road racing, especially junior style short and frantic races.

Whilst my opinion, I was really parroting David Millar and his opinion to training. Whilst he is quite old school he does know a thing or two.

Guys, don’t want to argue with anyone, especially after asking for help, but for info Junior road races are typically 80-100 riders competing over 70 miles of hilly country – first one is in the Brecon Beacons, second in the Mendips, etc. and some are stage races.

Breaks by small groups are common, often staying away and sometimes with riders bridging across or individuals escaping. Managing your efforts is as important as killing yourself to stay in any given group and the learning curve is steep as the junior category only lasts for two seasons.

Currently favouring rotor lt, but checking out p2m…

Without appearing too much of an arse, I know all that – was a junior, then a 1st cat, and then a slow transition to long distance tri in my 30s. Clearly power meters weren’t really around much when I was a proper roadie but I still say they are more useful in real time on a tt bike than a road bike. Having said that, you are right, when bridging or grimming it out in a break the numbers can be useful. I’d say they are really good when debriefing yourself (or with a coach) and using it a numerical reference to your real world rpe impression of how it panned out. I’d hate to think the next generation of roadies are being brought on totally focussed on numbers on the bars.

Ignore the nonsense that’s spouted about one sided power readings.

Or don’t. They’re inherently flawed.

As long as they are consistant I’m not sure it’s that big a deal. Most people look at the left/right power balance feature twice. If ‘only’ being able to justify a one sided one money wise, I’d still find it a useful tool over not having one at all. Reliable automatic or user capable calibration is more important imo. Srm used to have to go back to be calibrated after a chainring change or your super accurate readings could not be trusted which was a bit bobbins.

Convert, hadn’t explored power2max previously, but now very interested. Am I right in thinking that power is measured at the chainring? And would it work ok paired with a garmin edge 500 or do we need to think about upgrading head unit also?

Thanks

I’d hate to think the next generation of roadies are being brought on totally focussed on numbers on the bars.

probably a function of being coached on the BC system, power is measureable and therefore can go in the database. Still more medals for track than there is on the road.

I’d take the suggestion of renting a user calibratable device

Aye, measures at the spider. Any ant+ device will work. You don’t have to send ’em away to change the chainring or battery but the battery is a funny one. Never actually seen one in a shop but it’s no drama, they’re good for a good few hundred miles after the battery warning flashes on.

I did 5 ramp tests over 18 months at UEL with PhD exercise physiologist a mix of 1 min/3min 25 watt increments using SRM The results from these correlated exactly with the data I was getting from my Stages. Even if it was at best 1-2% difference which can happen at max power this isn’t going to matter or is it noticeable as it’s the consistency that matters. To add to this I also had a conversion with a BC coach who was also ex GB track cyclists who confirmed same.
@captianslow seriously recommend reading the book especially if you in the mix with racing which it sounds like you are.

My best mate is an old skool roadie raced the Ras in the late 80’s and for decades was a man who preached nothing but ‘bury yourself’ when it came to racing. Now on a stages PM for training & racing totally transformed his approach. The reason being he was getting beaten by guys who were on PMs who in the past couldn’t live him. They were racing smarter not harder.

Yes, measured at the spider between the chainring bolts and the right crank arm. The left arm is only a simulated reading. Your 500 will be fine as a head unit. Not sure what power outputs a 500 displays (I have a 810 head unit and a 910 ‘watch’) but would have thought it showed normalised. Good luck, it’s an exciting time having real choices for these things now, previously it was much less accessible.

Using my P2M with a 500. Lots of choices for the display.

I’ve used a P2M on a Rotor 3D crankset with an Edge 500 for the last three years. Nothing much to say about it because its worked fine through all sorts of weather with no problems and its only on its second battery as well (and I do a lot of miles). I’d buy another without any hesitation.

Update for anyone interested – choice now between power2max and rotor LT. I favour the former, son favours the latter.

He is likely to be borrowing a P2M for a couple of weeks so we will see how he gets on with that before springing the best part of £800

Thanks to all for input,

If it’s between those two I’d get the P2M. Does both sides whereas the LT just does one. The P2M has been around for a while too and seems to be niggle free.

If you are at all interested I have a brand new quarq riken bb30 chainset that I was looking to sell.

fhendry1 could you email me details on stevegiles8@gmail.com please?

Rotor LTs are impressive, as is the dual leg option but a bit expensive.
New stages seem to devoid of any problems that plagued early models.
Quarq Riken/Power2Max well worth considering, both appear to be problem free and not significantly more to get a reading for power from both legs. My P2M has been faultless, would happily buy again.

I wouldn’t touch the latest Powertaps due to a lack of reliability or Vectors – over priced and have seen some really dodgy L/R data which is their USP.

Regarding the 4iii, have we not all learnt yet that 1st gen power meters are generally a bad idea, or at least not giving them 3 months to sort out software?

I missed the Junior Tour of Wales through illness a couple of years ago, but from I heard that power meters were used lots and the numbers were big.

As mentioned earlier, I’m on my 3rd Stages since October, however, the battery on the current one is still showing a full charge after 3 weeks so hopefully what Ollie51 says is true. I was having to change the battery everyday on the previous two cranks., which is totally unacceptable.

Oh dear, I’m back again. Just as we were about to push the button and buy a quarq riken the opportunity to get a new bike came up and as it has a different crankset we are now thinking about garmin vectors.

Any additional experience of them please, especially moving them between bikes? Would be handy to be able to use them on his track bike also..

I have a stages but am liking the single sided vector. I also like the powercal, which gives comparable summay data. Vector and swap left hand crank rather than pedal would be my choice.