FWIW, if you set aside the secondhand/original owner, spesh UK do have an excellent reputation of warrantying frames to original owners, even on really old ones. I’ve read a few bad stories about stuff failing (07/08 alloy nippled DT wheel builds and all those epic shocks, anyone? 😆 ) but loads of good stories about the warranty/backup on this forum over the years.

Can’t really say CF is the best secondhand bike material either due to its limited lifespan.

What is the lifespan of Carbon Fiber? Aluminium has a limited lifespan as well you know.

Can’t really say CF is the best secondhand bike material either due to its limited lifespan.

Please, do go on.

It’s not a finite number, but the material composition deteriorates over time. The resin epoxy in carbon fiber will go stiff and crack or fatigue a lot faster than any metal. Even with some frames have carbon nano tubes as a resin filler you’re always face the fact that no existing resin epoxy can withstand UV and natural deterioration inherit to all resin products. The surface of carbon fiber is very soft and resin will crack when bump by strong forces. Eventually all resin epoxy based reinforce materials(fiber glass and carbon fiber) will warp.

Lots of riding = lots of microfractures within the epoxy carbon interfaces. The majority of these won’t cause a problem, but in the high stress areas, or a sudden off angle impact they can propogate and cause either just additional flex (due to them not reaching the surface), or complete cracks through the material as in the OP’s case.

This is the reason that Specialized built in electrodes to the original testing/pre-prod/racing layup carbon demo8/9 frames. When the material was first built they all connected, but as time progressed microfractures formed and broke the electrode connections. They set a threshold of number of connections to break before an in-built audible beeper sounded.
Once the beeper sounded they replaced them, and took the fatigued frames back to xray and analyse.
Imagine the publicity of a full frame failure in public!

Scar

Just to add…
I do know that which ever material you use it will eventually fail if stressed repeatedly.
It’s just CF frames will show no visible signs of this until complete failure (would you really know if the frame was flexing more that it did when it came off the shop floor?), so you could easily buy a frame thats starting to fail.

Scar

I had cause to use Specialized’s warranty, I noticed that the frame was cracking around the bottom bracket, this was on my 2004 FSR.

They replaced it with a nice shiny new 2008 FSR Expert frame which I built up to this.

I’d of thought that Spesh would at least do a crash replacement for you.

They more than likely would if the frame was bought in the UK. But considering the OP deliberately bi-passed them then why should they. They have no obligation too.

Customer Support/warranty/service etc is built into the price. If you don’t pay it don’t expect to receive it.

Singlespeed_Shep – Member

I’d of thought that Spesh would at least do a crash replacement for you.

They more than likely would if the frame was bought in the UK. But considering the OP deliberately bi-passed them then why should they. They have no obligation too.

Customer Support/warranty/service etc is built into the price. If you don’t pay it don’t expect to receive it.

It would cost them nothing as they charge 40% of the RRP and they get a reputation for “Good sevice”
I believe the frames they offer as crash replacement are “Gash” ones they have lying around.
Mine was a crash replacement and it came without the original shock [brain] but did have a Triad with it.

It would cost them nothing

It’s not a frame they ever imported to the UK though so they won’t just have one lying around.

Hello,

I would just like to clarify some points here.

Mr Scar has made some points, here however I would like to add some detail as these points could be misunderstood. I’m not intending to have a pop at you Mr Scar, just filing in details.

Can’t really say CF is the best secondhand bike material either due to its limited lifespan.

This is a slightly ambiguous statement. In essence everything has a limited life span. It will depend on the application and various external factors. Aluminium and also steel could also be described as having limited life spans. So we must be clear bout this.

“It’s not a finite number, but the material composition deteriorates over time. The resin epoxy in carbon fiber will go stiff and crack or fatigue a lot faster than any metal.”

Metals too will deteriorate over time. The statement that CF will go stiff and crack faster then any metal is simply does not make sense. One of the biggest advantages of CF composites is that they have longer fatigue life in comparison to metals.

By saying that they go hard and crack you imply that there is some deterioration. Of course plastics can deteriorate, however almost all plastics today have UV inhibitors.

Even with some frames have carbon nano tubes as a resin filler you’re always face the fact that no existing resin epoxy can withstand UV and natural deterioration inherit to all resin products.

Mentioning nano tubes in the same sentence as UV and “natural degradation” implies that nano fillers are there to prevent these from happening. Nano tubes are “functional fillers” their use is aimed at improving mechanical performance, rather than environmental performance.

The surface of carbon fiber is very soft and resin will crack when bump by strong forces. Eventually all resin epoxy based reinforce materials(fiber glass and carbon fiber) will warp.

Not sure what is meant here, carbon fibre is soft or the composite surface is soft. nevertheless, this statement seems to contradict the previous which refers to hardening. Soft materials are typically more resistant to cracking (after impact) than those which are hard.

Moreover, I would like to make clear that UV or environmental issues are not a problem for composite materials. Do you think that modern aircraft would have significant amounts of primary structure made from composites if they were going to degrade in UV and fail ? not really. Aero companies have researched these materials for decades. Testing often spans decades. I worked for one company which continues its environmental assessment of composites today. About 50 years ago they started by putting test specimens round the world in extreme weather environmental. Every year coupons have been tested and compared with the control-no significant degradation of these has occurred.

Lots of riding = lots of microfractures within the epoxy carbon interfaces.

It is not clear what you are saying here. Never the less it implies that riding time is proportional to some kind of internal defect creation. Again this is not a good statement.

The majority of these won’t cause a problem, but in the high stress areas, or a sudden off angle impact they can propogate and cause either just additional flex (due to them not reaching the surface), or complete cracks through the material as in the OP’s case.

Also an unclear statement, not entirely sure what is supposed to reach the surface. I think you mean these cracks? I think you mean that if you hit the composite real hard it might crack.

It would cost them nothing as they charge 40% of the RRP

Spec UK haven’t made any money on it either.

they get a reputation for “Good sevice”

Depends, if i was a specialized Uk retailer, I’d be a bit miffed if they kept honoring warranties for people who buy from outside the UK.

It’s not a finite number, but the material composition deteriorates over time

This makes no sense. If something can be observed deteriorating over time then surely there must a number of measure.

Is the time a million years? Or 1 year? Do you have some data?

Also, what is an ‘off angle impact’ – do carbon frames have a preferred on angle impact angle?

You take your chances when you but SH and it must have been a very hard strike to bust a pedal.

If you have the frame repaired take into account that the bike has a low BB in the first place and the nature of the suspension tends to keep it even lower. When I rode a 2011 enduro the shock blew through too fast for my liking even with 20% sag. Combination of all three meant I had to be really careful to avoid pedal strikes and that’s why I decided against getting one.

I’m wondering why they’ve started making planes out of a short life material.

Just to make it clear again it was the spring in the pedal,and the pedals were 9 years old and had a fair bit of use.about the shock going through the stroke even with 20% sag,I found that from the moment I rode the bike and was going to send the shock to push to try and solve that problem.2 weeks to late I suppose :/.
Might try a ibis hd or intense carbine.( new ) 🙂

grum – Member

Which companies do offer warranty on second hand frames?

Cotic don’t exactly offer warranty, but they’ve looked after me better than any company I’ve actually had a warranty with.

Buyer beware with Specialized. OP although you bought it from a different market where the UK distributor wasnt even involved/supplied that frame of yours. Why should they take a hit for you? (Selling you a reduced price replacement impacts on their warranty-stocked available frames).

“Hello, is that Specialized UK?”

“Yes, how can I help?”

“I’ve bought this bike secondhand from the states to save some money. I don’t know anything about it’s history, but I got it for a good price. Trouble Is the frame’s broken and it’s too much hassle to get it sorted by Specialized US, and they wouldn’t have any obligation to help me anyway. So would you be good enough to give me a new frame at cost price, even though I haven’t paid anything for any sort of warranty from you?”

Bike Scene are advertising 2013 frames for £3000. 😉

Not a good thread to mention my Whyte E-120 frame for sale then? and yes, i’d be looking to get another carbon frame to replace it 🙂

“Hello, is that Specialized UK?”

“Yes, how can I help?”

“I’ve bought this bike secondhand from the states to save some money. I don’t know anything about it’s history, but I got it for a good price. Trouble Is the frame’s broken and it’s too much hassle to get it sorted by Specialized US, and they wouldn’t have any obligation to help me anyway. So would you be good enough to give me a new frame at cost price, even though I haven’t paid anything for any sort of warranty from you?”

True. Imagine buying a Ford Taurus, shipping it over and demanding Ford UK sort it for you?