My daughter and another girl, both more or less minimum wage earners, share a flat with 2 students. As the students are exempt from council tax, this means that my daughter and the other earner are splitting the council tax bill. That doesn’t seem fair – does anyone know if this is the correct interpretation of the council tax rules?

Apart from that, has anyone been in the same situation? If so – how did you work it out? I want to suggest that she asks the students to contribute. Is that unreasonable?

Seems correct to me, if there was only one non student then certainly here in edinburgh that person would get a single person discount, but with two non students that isn’t possible. I live with a student and pay all the council tax and remember not paying any when I was a lazy pot smoking post-grad student living with working friends.

2 points of view:

1. If the students were not living with working people they wouldnt be paying any council tax so why should they contribute.

2. They are all living together and splitting the bills to make it cheaper to live as some costs are fixed or going to happen regardless – eg standing charges, water, heating, power for fridge, freezer etc so the students are benefiting from that so should pay council tax.

But, to argue against 2 the savings on bills will probably not cover the council tax they end up paying and in 1 the workers are still saving on the communal bills.

Council tax rules? The only rule is pay it. The council does not provide rules on who should pay in a house, it just wants the money it is charging.

My GF and I have a friend who is an intern living with us. Bills are split 3 ways except for the council tax which we cover. I don’t see why he should pay the council tax so I am in the students don’t pay camp.

What seems unfair to me is that if the students lived on their own, the cost of taking away their trash (etc) would be shared out among all the other tax payers in the borough. As it is, they cost is borne just by my daughter and friend. Effectively her tax is doubled. I understand and agree with the pov the students should not have to pay ct, but at the same time it puts a burden on their flat mates. My daughter is a nice person, but I am a grumpy old bastard, and in her shoes I’d avoid sharing with students.

Your pov makes no sense to me. Take the students out of the equation and your daughter still pays CT. Take your daughter out of the equation and the students still do not pay CT.

The point I think, cb is that if they weren’t living with students they’d be in a much smaller, lower band property (that or sharing with other people who do pay tax). As it is they are paying tax for a larger property, not all of which they are using.

The trouble is, it’s unfair either way. I can’t see any way to resolve it which isn’t unfair on the students though.

But if your daughter was the student and living with working people would you be arguing for it the other way?

Students don’t earn much/anything. If we started making students pay council tax then loans/parental contributions would have to go up or the council would spend a fortune chasing skint students for council tax. Council tax is priced to account for those in society who are exempt and the students will be paying it soon enough when they graduate but in the mean time remember that students bring a lot of money into cities which benefits all the local businesses and people who pay taxes. What goes around comes around.

Your daughter is still much better off than if she was living by herself – 70% council tax and all the bills to herself.

re: tax band – that is very true and a good point. The only way I would suggest to sort it out is before any contracts are signed. I would still expect that in this case your daughter is not really any worse off due to bills split than if it was just two of them living in a lower band house. Not an amount that’s worth rocking the boat over anyway.

I guess you could always agree to have the students pay the difference if you really wanted to be like that but still not fair on them.

Your daughter is still much better off than if she was living by herself – 70% council tax and all the bills to herself.

70% of much lower council tax.

not really.

You are looking at £160-180 per band difference here in the SW for the A-E which is what I would expect student accommodation to come under. I would expect at very most a 3 band difference so £450-540 more.

Using Bristol as a gauge, 1 bed flat in decent area is band B.
0.7 x 1266 = £886

2 people out of 4 sharing a band E:
0.5 x 1990 = £995

So £9 a month difference. By the time you split TV licence, phone/internet, standing charges etc etc that is easily made up for.

I just checked my old student 4 bed house in Bristol and it is a D. My flat I bought when I was a post grad is a B so that works out as 2x £814, ie £72 a year better off than living alone and paying 70% tax.

Your daughter is still much better off than if she was living by herself – 70% council tax and all the bills to herself.

But much worse off than if she was sharing with 3 other working people. As it is she is paying about the same as me.

What did they agree to do when they all moved in together?

In future she will know that it is best not to live with students for this reason.

Are her student flat mates pissing in the shower?

I wouldn’t be happy paying shared water rates if I was saving money by pissing in the shower 😉

😉

I had a year working while away at uni and kept living with my uni friends.

It was a 6 bedroom Victorian terrace; a big house. It cost me a fortune paying the council tax as the only professional. My choice though.

I would have “moved back” with my parents and continued to live with my friends :)( for a year in industry at uni- not long term)

Sounds like the housemates should discuss it between themselves and come to an agreement without outside interference.

If it’s such a big issue your daughter should have thought about it before moving in with students. She should have known the deal and made her decision based on that information. If she didn’t then she’s learned a valuable lesson. Such is life.

You do realise that you get a discount on the bill because you have students in the house. It’s usually 25%.

If it’s such a big issue your daughter should have thought about it before moving in with students. She should have known the deal and made her decision based on that information. If she didn’t then she’s learned a valuable lesson. Such is life.

Indeed. This is her first job and first time living out of uni hall, so much to learn – about council tax and also about what utter bastards landlords can be. Too bad it all has to be the hard way.

geetee1972 – Member
You do realise that you get a discount on the bill because you have students in the house. It’s usually 25%.

POSTED 56 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

You do realise half of 75%is more than quarter of 100% right?

In our flat of four we have one student who has gone back to uni since moving in. Simple conversation was had council tax is shared between everyone in the flat thats what I’d expect and have done in the past when I’ve been the student.

You do realise half of 75%is more than quarter of 100% right?

Eh? The students don’t pay council tax, clearly you’re inferring they should, but that’s unfair. IMO the onus is on the OPs daughter – it was her choice to live there. Ergo paying half of 75% is preferable to half of 100%

The trouble is, it’s unfair either way. I can’t see any way to resolve it which isn’t unfair on the students though.

Move out and get a smaller cheaper council tax band flat. Problem solved.

Next!

You do realise that you get a discount on the bill because you have students in the house. It’s usually 25%.

It depends on the case. Council tax must be paid in full if there 2 adults in the same house. Students and kids etc. Don’t count as adults, so once you’ve ignored them, whoever is left contributes to the overall tax burden.

In the OPs case there are 2 adults so the council tax must be paid in full. How they divide that up is something to discuss amongst themselves.

It does show a lack of forward planning that they’re in this situation.

I’ve lived n a 4 bed house with 1 student. We as a group never asked her for council tax as we knew before we moved in together she was exempt. We wanted to live together as a group to allowed for the slight extra financial burden.

I have no sympathy for the OPs daughter in this situation as the rules are pretty clear.

You do realise that you get a discount on the bill because you have students in the house. It’s usually 25%.

No you don’t.

You are talking about the single occupancy discount presumably.

Not applicable in this case.

EDIT- beaten to it.

It does show a lack of forward planning that they’re in this situation.

Yes, clearly deplorable that a young inexperienced person excited about living away for the first time did not consider every nuance.

I have no sympathy for the OPs daughter in this situation as the rules are pretty clear.

Don’t worry about it, mate, she’s not looking for my sympathy and still less yours.

I had a year working while away at uni and kept living with my uni friends.

It was a 6 bedroom Victorian terrace; a big house. It cost me a fortune paying the council tax as the only professional. My choice though.

At my Uni when we did our year in industry we were still registered full time students, would of thought it was the same at most unis (were you asked to start paying back loan for example?). If that’s the case you shouldn’t have paid anything… i’d send a letter to the council.

Ignoring all the above.

I want to suggest that she asks the students to contribute. Is that unreasonable?

No, but they may decline.

I’m a student. We get the 25% discount and I have always paid my share of the remaining bill.

I don’t have to but then it just feels a bit mean not to and also results in no arguments.

Yes, clearly deplorable that a young inexperienced person excited about living away for the first time did not consider every nuance.

Everyone flys the nest at some point, and some make mistakes along the way. This is a tiny one in the grand scheme of things. She (and you) should just to chalk it up to one of lifes great learning experiences and move on.

I can’t see how asking the students to contribute is fair, or likely to go down particularly well.

it’s her decision – maybe she wants to live with her mates.

I bet she spends wayyyy more on booze.

If your daughter’s on a low income might she be eligible for help with CT?
https://www.gov.uk/apply-council-tax-reduction

Indeed. This is her first job and first time living out of uni hall, so much to learn – about council tax and also about what utter bastards landlords can be. Too bad it all has to be the hard way.

Obviously she was absent when the uni did life skills courses.

Not all landlords are bastrds, and not all temants tell the truth and treat properties as if they had any money tied up in them, and respected the furniture and fitings.

Housing benefit, tax credits and council tax rebates are all avilable.

Strikes me as a bit silly to declare there’s non students living in there. 😆

Obviously she was absent when the uni did life skills courses.

Possibly, but she hasn’t lived in the UK since she was 10 years old, and probably her primary school was a bit negligent on the “council tax” part of the curriculum.

I’m a student. We get the 25% discount and I have always paid my share of the remaining bill.

I don’t have to but then it just feels a bit mean not to and also results in no arguments.

Well, this, but we seem to be in a minority. Anyway, as others have said, probably best she just chalks it up to experience.

My daughter and another girl, both more or less minimum wage earners, share a flat with 2 students. As the students are exempt from council tax, this means that my daughter and the other earner are splitting the council tax bill.

Do the students earn any money? I lived in plenty of shared households when I was younger and, although the Council would hold everyone in the house jointly liable if somebody worked, we never made anyone who was studying or unwaged start paying CT at that point. Usually people who started working would move elsewhere, with the taking on of the entire CT liability being just one of the motivations. I would suggest that if your daughter is unhappy with the situation then she moves into a property with fellow ‘professionals’, unless of course the students find themselves comfortable with taking on extra financial burden. It doesn’t really matter what you/we think, as each house will have its own blend of ethics to deal with.

This is just one of the issues with shared households; another is when one or two people move out, leaving others to pick up their share of the bills. It’s not really a matter of fairness, though, it’s just part of the fluctuating economics of shared living.

Your daughter benefits by being invited to much better and more frequent social events than if she shared the house with employed people. That alone justifies the council tax offset.

if the students lived on their own, the cost of taking away their trash (etc) would be shared out among all the other tax payers in the borough. As it is, they cost is borne just by my daughter and friend.

Yeah… no.

But much worse off than if she was sharing with 3 other working people. As it is she is paying about the same as me.

Well she should have thought about that before she moved in with them. She had the choice at the time.

oh and need not sure where I got 70% from, it is indeed 75% so that would put the person by themself in an even worse position.

best thing you can do is tell her to save a third of her income, pay all her bills, and then anything left over is for spends.

berating her and her friends over council tax is, frankly, something you shouldn’t be doing.

you are no longer management, you’re a consultant.