As it says above really, looking at getting a steel hardtail as a second bike to my Orange Five. What are peoples thoughts opinions on both and why?

Looking at building a lightish spec with 120mm forks, x2’s and 2×10, etc. Will be riding Hampshire & Surrey singletrack mainly on this stead. On a secondary note Maverick forks, any good compared to Fox?

Thanks for your thoughts

Just built up a soul as a second bike to my five too! Only issue is that the five hasn’t had a look in since. Couldn’t recommend it more, got pikes fitted to mine wound down to 130mm with wide bars and short stem, loads and loads of fun.
Can’t comment on the whyte but the Soul feels just perfect for me.

Can highly recommend the Cotic Soul, since buying it my SC Blur LT has been left unused.

The Soul is just a total blast on every ride!!

Having just ordered a Soul I was hoping for a positive Cotic response. I am going 120mm but 1X10.

Cotic Soul is the way to go. (but I am biased, as there 3 Cotics in the house)
I would go fox forks, spares are easier to get and more places to get it serviced.
But saying that Maverick forks seam to work ok from what I hear.

Seems quite conclusive on the frame choice then. With regards to forks, i was probably going to buy some RS Reba Team Dual Air (120/maxle) as there are good deals around compared to the Fox F120 at the moment, Maverick was just another option.

I’ve posted on this very subject before… repeat…

I can now comment on this since I’ve tried both. I own a Whyte 19 Steel and have test ridden a Cotic Soda; both in Medium frame sizes with 120mm forks.

The big difference is that with the Cotic you sit “in” the bike and with the Whyte you sit “on” it – what seem on the surface to be very similar bikes do have quite different personalities.

There is a big difference between the bottom bracket height of the two with the Cotic having the lower by almost 20mm, which explains I think why I feel perched on the Whyte but ride in the Cotic. This gives the Cotic more stability and speed with a more racey feel to it, the Whyte however does not feel nervous which is usually what I find a high BB gives you. The reason for this is I believe the slacker head angle on the Whyte (67deg vs 69deg) which gives it great stability and stops it “stalling” when slammed into trail features, a trait I found occasionally with the Cotic.

Seat angle (71deg) and chainstay lenght between the two was nearly identical (Whyte dropouts in the middle) so for climbing they are very similar, although for techy work the Cotic did ding a pedal more frequently due to the lower bottom bracket (natch), but it also felt a little more planted than the Whyte.

For the rutted super sketchy gnar terrain I like they both performed well with the saddle dropped, but with different traits. The Cotic was harder to hold the line with and the front wanted to tuck under sending the back over, or that’s how it felt, like I had to get further back behind the saddle to keep control. I also had to take care with the pedals to prevent banging them, but it was all certainly fun and much better than old skool XC geometry.
The Whyte feels more sketchy dropping in but once in the flow the bike feels planted and to me more manoeuvrable as I didn’t feel the need to be so far over the back. Neither of them is a plower like my big bike and they both needed plenty of input to keep them upright and going in the correct direction. When coming out of the gnar the Whyte was quicker to recover it’s composure and sprint to the next obstacle like a mini BMX. For berms and chucking into fast corners the Cotic felt quicker as long as the trails were smooth; I found the Cotic tended to get knocked off line easier and suffered the “stalling” I mentioned earlier when the trails were not smooth or there was deep mud.

Note – I’m used to the Whyte and the Cotic was new to me so preferences will vary but I can say with certainty that both of these bikes are a hoot and either is great. Both are way better in the gnar and trails were I ride than traditional XC bikes.

I’d love to try something that steals what I see as the best of both bikes: Drop the bottom bracket height on the Whyte a little or kick out the head angle a couple of degrees on the Cotic.

Material issues – The Cotic which was Ti felt a little punchier than the steel Whyte under sprinting, but both were lovely and had the springy feel I like. The Cotic was the lighter bike but it was not really noticeable on the trails due to the hefty coating of mud acquired by both bikes.

I’ll be sticking with my Whyte for the moment but if I had a Cotic I would be sticking with it too – different but equally brilliant fun. Now… what else can I try

A longer fork than 120mm on either would damage the techy climbing ability in my opinion… but the Cotic could get away with it because of the lower bottom bracket, raising the Whyte’s already high BB is asking for a very unstable bike… again, in my opinion… but yours may vary.

PS – ability to singlespeed the Whyte is nice as is playing with the chainstay lengths. Long is good in the summer for dry trails and speed, shorter in the winter for muddy grip and feel. I ended up racing mine at the euro singlespeed champs when my other bike died on the social ride.

I also have a Five and a Soul. Used to ride Surrey Hills and the Five stopped getting a looking after I bought the Soul but overall I think they partner well as they both handle so well.
The Soul is ace for Surrey Hills singletrack – you realise why FS is overkill for a lot of stuff round there – it’s much quicker round the sharp corners e.g. Summer Lightning
I recommend riding both regularly and your riding will improve massively

If you want steel, go with the Soul. If you’d consider Ali then try a 19 as IMO the ali model is better than the steel option. Which to go for out of Soul or Ali 19 would be down to you though, both good in their own ways.

Everyone should own a soul.

Think I may have to go for a Soul, colour choices…. orange or black?

Orange!

Orange is simply stunning.

I had a similar dilemma, except it was a new soul or a soda…

Had I gone for a new Soul it would have been, with out a shadow of a doubt, orange (my existing one is black…).

Really, I don’t think you’ll be disappointed.