I live and ride in the Peak District. Unlikely to venture too far (young babies).

So which one would you pick?
(I’m 6′ 3″ and gonna stick a 140mm fork on the front)

http://www.cotic.co.uk/geek/
Same geo I believe, are you going to smash it or float it through/over stuff

A bit of both really.
Local riding includes Charity Lane (Macclesfield forest)
Cumberland Brook, three shires head etc . plenty of road to link it all together.

And then mainly over towards Ladybower res or Romans Lake (Marple).

Basically, rocky downhills

Thanks

I think at 6’3 (and presumably not racing snake judging by your name!) you’d probably be better off with the BFe for riding rocky downhills with a 140mm fork. The Soul does that great too but I think the tipping point to the BFe being the better choice happens at a less aggro point if you’re taller and heavier, due to the large frame being less stiff than the medium and the rider forces on it that much greater.

There’s not that much in it in terms of weight now, only 0.7lbs and the current BFe isn’t as crazy rigid at the back as the original version was. And conversely for smaller lighter riders I think the Soul makes a lot of sense, I bet the XS is great for gnarr ragging when you’re well under 10 stone.

@chiefgrooveguru. Thanks, much appreciated. I’m 13.5 stone (although usually 13 dead)
So is the Soul too flexy for my weight/140 travel/peak district rocks??

I have a BFe, I bought it as I wanted a do it all hardtail with a bias towards fun and the other major factor was at the time it was £300 whereas the Soul was £480. Mine has 120/150 adjustable forks and very nice Hope brakes/wheels – so its strong and very chuck able. You should take a demo and see which you prefer, IMO the Soul will not be “too flexy”. Given your fork I would lean towards the BFe.

Mam Tor April 2012

The head honcho at cotic Cy is a helpful bloke see if you can email him and get his opinion.

I’ve had both and preferred the BFe, which I still run. Soul was lovely and has an ace back end but a bit too twangy for how I like it. Depends on your style, weight, and terrain I guess.

Why buy a frame designed for a 100-120mm fork, and put a 140mm fork on it? Get a BFe.

Dan – I am the same height as you but possibly better fed ..

go for the BFe – the feel will be better. Dunno why , it just is ( I have a 1st Gen Soul and Bfe)

The Soul feels a little too small, whilst the Bfe doesn’t ( I have no idea why)

@b r. I thought the geometry for Soul & BFe were the same?

The geometry of the BFe and Soul is indeed identical and both ride very well with a 140mm fork.

I don’t think the Soul will be too flexy but also I don’t think the BFe will be too stiff, so it’ll be a personal choice. You’re lighter than I expected! What’s the 140mm fork you’re using?

@b r. I thought the geometry for Soul & BFe were the same?

Happy to be corrected.

It’s just that one of our crew has a Beefy with 150mm forks and another a Soul with 120mm forks – he’d tried 140mm ones on the Soul but not happy with how it rode…

Must be all in the head.

I had this exact dilemma at the beginning of the year. Got myself a Bfe which i run at 140mm and use for everything from XC, trail centre, Enduro and some light DH. So much fun. I’m not the lightest chap & I’ve never ridden a Soul. After reading all the chat about different flex/strengths of frame etc i wanted a bike that i could try anything with and the Bfe is that bike. inspiring, fun & highly recommended!

I’m 2 rides in on a BFe , built up 10 days ago ,its a very stiff frame ,I’m only running 100mm at the front.I’m 17 stone and we just plough through rocky down hills .I felt out of my depth yesterday on 1 DH but the bike just rode through,very confidence inspiring?

It’s a 140mm Fox Float 15qr

@b r. I thought the geometry for Soul & BFe were the same?

Happy to be corrected.

It’s just that one of our crew has a Beefy with 150mm forks and another a Soul with 120mm forks – he’d tried 140mm ones on the Soul but not happy with how it rode…

Must be all in the head.

They are the same
I have 130s on the soul and 140s on the BFe. They feel different – it may just be that the Bfe is chunkier – I just prefer the ride …

Floats are quite flexi, no?
More suited to a Soul than BFe IMHO. (talking as someone who ran Pikes on a Soul, which is the opposite, didn’t like that combo!)

Floats flexi? Really what about 140 vanilla 32? I have these on my bfe and find them good n stiff oooeer.

Toys, compared to Pikes for instance… Now that’s stiffer than a stiff thing… 😉

I’m 5’8″ and obviously well nourished at 12.5 stone. I have a medium BFe with the 140mm Fox Supa Noodles. I struggle to find anything it can’t do from all days out in Scotland, rock bashing in the Lakes and Peak and playing in the woods. My limit is obviously somewhat less than that of the bike.

Really, pikes are 32 also arent they. I reckon 15mm qr foxs are as stiff as any other 32mm forks.
Edit – just googled 2014 pikes they are 35mm.

b r – Member

Why buy a frame designed for a 100-120mm fork, and put a 140mm fork on it? Get a BFe.

they two have the same geometry… the Soul is designed for a 120mm fork. why should the Bfe then ride better with a 150mm fork…? surely the Bfe should have a very similar feel to the Soul and feel best at 120mm. why is it then sold as the gnarly Cotic when the difference is a change in tubes, not angles?

seems a bit of a cop out/lazy from Cotic.

*have a friend with a Bfe. nice frame (poor man’s Soul?)

12.5st kitted with my soul running 120mm, and have another set of talas 140mm as another option. Find the talas a wee bit flexi.

Reckon bfe would be better for peaks with stiffer forks IMO given your a st heavier.

I had the same decision a few weeks ago and went for the bfe. I ride in the peaks am 6 2 and 94kg and figured it maybe be better suited to my size. It is built with 140mm slants, big tires and a reverb. Done 4 rides and really enjoyed it so far looking forward to taking it to the lakes in a couple of weeks, not missing my full suss (yet).

Forks can vary vastly in stiffness whilst having the same stanchion diameter – lots of variables including lowers, bushings, arches, crown, steerer, dropouts, axle and of course the wall thickness of those stanchions. I think I’d go for a BFe. If you were the same weight but shorter and therefore on a medium it would be a very difficult decision!

The Float 140s aren’t super stiff but they’re not that noodly – with some fairly stiff wheels it should batter through the rocks with impunity.

Regarding the geometry working well with various fork lengths – as you lengthen the fork you raise the headtube, slacken the head angle, shorten the top tube, raise the bottom bracket and slacken the seat tube. All this makes the frame better at going down the rough stuff, apart from the BB height issue which is more contentious (reduced pedal strikes in the gnarr, greater ease of manualling, but less stable). I believe the Soul was originally designed for a 100mm fork despite many claiming that 120mm is the ‘sweet spot’. Basically changing the fork length manages to change the whole character of the bike in a remarkably cohesive way.

I’ve run my Soul with Vanilla’s (at both 100 & 125), Pikes, Talas and Floats (120’s).

Pikes were the stiffest (by a county mile, and too stiff for my liking on the Soul), Talas the flexiest (even set at 120, my Soul only rated to 130).

The correct answer though is ^^^ though. OP, give Cotic a call and talk through your riding style and kit choice. They have the knowledge, and they know their stuff. I’d rather go with what the designer says than what some numpty on a forum ‘thinks’ (and I mean myself in that latter category, no disrespect intended to any other poster).

I’ve git a used but in excellent condition large cotic soul frame for sale in the classified in you’re interested ?

Cheers
Jason