I’m hoping someone on here might be able to offer some advice about the situation I find myself in with my employer.

I’ve worked at the large company in question for a little over 2 years, I’m a group project engineer for the company, so the idea is that I’m a central resource who moves to where the work is. For my time there I’ve had a role on one site working on a major project. It has been a hard project with various difficulties along the way including my original line manager being removed part way through last year due to his performance.

I got a good performance review for 2011, with bonus, payrise etc all awarded because of it. My mid year review (july) for 2012 was positive and indicated no significant problems.

Around august 2012 my line management was changed for the first time (to my previous bosses boss) but I did not see him at any point during the time he was my line manager. There were various other changes to my line management over the period with conflicting information as to who I was working for provided. On site I worked for the new project manager and mid december 2012 my line management changed to him after I asked for some feedback from him. This feedback was poor. At no point in the intervening period from my mid year review had any indication been given to me that my performance was unacceptable. In early 2013 my 2012 final review was completed by him and I was given the worst grade possible.

As soon as this occurred I lodged an appeal which has finally today, after around 10 weeks been completed, this has upheld the initial grading of my performance. I appealed on the grounds that not only was the assessment unfair but primarily that the process to tell me of an issue with my performance was not acceptable as nothing was done.

With the result of the appeal now in I feel that I cannot continue for work for a company which has treated me in this way. It is also worth noting that everyone else that I have discussed my performance grading with at the company has been shocked at the grade I received and did not view it as fair. As I feel that I have been left with no option but to leave I’m wondering if I might have grounds for an unfair/constructive dismissal claim?

Apologies for the essay but if anyone has any advice to give it would be gratefully received! I also can’t think of a place where such a broad range of questions can be answered!

I don’t think you’ve grounds for unfair dismissal, so just deal with it – options:

1 Find a way to work with your new line-manager
2 Wait for a new line-manager and carry on.
3 Look for another job.

IBM, or equivilent? Only ask as a friend worked for them (for +10 years) and he’d never met his line-manager, in the couple of years he worked for him. Amazed me at the time.

They want you out, a simple task now the cons are in.

Look for another job fast.

If they can justify your poor grade to a tribunal, then no you probably don’t have a case.

If they can’t, then maybe you do have a case.

Are you a member of a union ?

Unfortunately no, not a member of a union. The company don’t recognise any for engineering staff.

The grade is unreasonable but it would be the process I would be appealing against as much as anything. To not tell me at a point where I have chance to influence the outcome seems entirely unreasonable to me?

On the surface, I’m inclined to agree with project. This *sounds* like a hatchet job but I think you’d struggle to gather any evidence to support this. You might be questioning how far this goes. The project manager might be looking for a scapegoat or the business could have bigger ideas in mind.

I think you’re right in principle, you should be having regular 121’s or similar where poor performance should be highlighted providing you the opportunity to correct things but in the absence of any formalised, documented processes (do you have these?), you might want to start looking elsewhere.

There has been a huge amount of politics around the whole thing and my previous manager has also been given a poor review despite a mid year that said he’d 80% achieved all objectives. We have been used as a scapegoat for issues with the project that were not at all of our doing or responsibility. We’re being used as an excuse to save some bigger people.

Samuri I presume you mean the company having a formal documented process? If so I’ll do some more digging but when I’ve asked before there’s been nothing forth coming.

Sounds like poor management but you might not get far in court. Even if you win you’ll do well to get much. Maybe 4 weeks pay or more likely 2 as you have only been there 2 years. If you think it is time to go you could propose a compromise agreement. That will be a lot less hassle on both sides and you might get a couple of months pay. They might be keen if you are being managed out. What ever you do don’t go thinking there is big bucks up for grabs.

Not a legal expert

my wife got within a 3 day hearing for unfair dismissal. This was with union support. Like anything legal its complicated, slow and potentially expensive. Its not a process you would ever opt to be in. You might use it if you had no choice

Gathering evidence will be crucial. Whatever happens you should assume that the company will stand up and tell a version of events that supports their side.

I am sympathetic to your situation and you’ve been treated badly. But my wife situation is much worse and we have come to realise that the legal safety net is hard to access at unlikely to gain us justice

Look for another job, but do your level best to shaft the project as hard as you can. If they are going to treat you like a ****, you’re absolutely entitled to act like one.

I should also add that during the appeal process no one has contacted the person I worked for during the majority of 2012 to ask his view on my performance. Again this does not seem reasonable to me, surely this person has to be part of a review of my performance?

Also the differing treatment of myself and others in the team is clear to see, they were rewarded for work over the Christmas period, I was excluded from the reward despite the exact same work being done. There are other examples too and clearly my new manager just doesn’t like me for reasons that are not clear to me.

Yes, I mean the company. If they have documented an ongoing process for managing performance (and most reasonably sized companies will have), then they must provide evidence that this process has been followed. If the process is as you’ve described then they’ve followed the appropriate path and the assessment is in their eyes, fair.

I would simply not be allowed to do this in my company. If a member of my team shot from a good assessment to a poor one in a matter of six months without me making a formalised attempt to resolve it, my performance would be called into question as a manager.

Get proper advice.

From a purely business point of view this sort of thing is madness- if there’s a performance problem, why wait 6 months to raise it? When I was in the bank I had a manager raise an issue in a year end review which had been bothering her for 12 months, I didn’t even know it was a thing. There was a good reason for it which once I explained it put it to bed but she’d been fuming for a year for no reason, and if it had been a genuine problem we’d have fixed it! Just ridiculous.

But yes there’s 2 sides to it- one is the fairness/accuracy/defensibility of the actual assessment, and the other is the process followed. If both can be called into question things get more viable- if they can’t evidence or justify their poor grading then it’s certainly worth looking into. But of course, it’s not quite that simple, it’s possible to stick with subjective comments, exaggerate or misinterpret real events, etc and that sort of thing is difficult to refute.

Crikey … you have only been there for 2 years … didn’t you learn to brown nose at every opportunity? Yes, when they said “jump boy” … you should have answered “triple whatever height the next person agrees to”.

Forget it as it will not worth the hassle and it’s better to put your energy/anger into searching for something better while you are raring to go.

They just don’t like you for whatever reasons so why fight to be accepted? Grab or squeeze whatever you can that you think you deserve and move on.

nickjb – Member

Sounds like poor management but you might not get far in court. Even if you win you’ll do well to get much. Maybe 4 weeks pay or more likely 2 as you have only been there 2 years. If you think it is time to go you could propose a compromise agreement. That will be a lot less hassle on both sides and you might get a couple of months pay. They might be keen if you are being managed out. What ever you do don’t go thinking there is big bucks up for grabs.

^^^ This one … then …

1. Look elsewhere because they have already made up their mind they do not like you.

2. Start your own company employing Polish, Chinese, Koreans … they will get the building up in no time. Be fair to them but you do need to double your quality control … just in case.

3. Be a sub contractor to other big construction companies … employing Polish, Chinese, Koreans …

You haven’t been dismissed so there is no case, in fact it sounds like you are going to do exactly what they want by leaving. If you stick around and they do dismiss you then you might have a case

skids – Member

You haven’t been dismissed so there is no case,

That’s not how constructive dismissal works.

So, they’ve given you a poor grading in this years appraisal, and its clearly bollocks – but what have they put in place as a “next steps”?

Are they going to further review in X months, or given you an improvement plan? if they haven’t done that, then it would strengthen your case for a future constructive, but I reckon that it might be a little too early for it just yet, as all you’ve had is the one poor appraisal.

I’d be inclined to build up any ammunition you can use against them now, any wrongdoing etc – anything you see him do wrong, write it down and keep a diary – anything you can launch a grievance against him or them on, do it, especially if you can find something to whistleblow (reporting a racist comment or joke perhaps) as all this stuff makes it messy for them, and increases the chance of them settling with a compromise agreement, constructive D cases are notoriously difficult to win.

First off your previous review is irrelevant, no buts. I did good last year but I can’t ride on the back of that and say my review this year should be medium instead of poor because last year was good.
You said there were issues on the project, if there was fault you have to prove due diligence that the mistakes make were no your fault by showing you had all measures in place to stop the errors, communication and training was in place and when the error was spotted you reacted to it appropriately and put measures in place to ensure it doesn’t happen again in the future. Or, the problems encountered were unforeseeable and could not have been prevented by ANYBODY.
If you can’t then you have to accept responsibility and instead of sinking go above and beyond to show you have learnt from these mistakes and jobs go mistake free. If you are responsible yet try to appeal it just says to me and your bosses that you don’t learn from mistakes and will probably do them again.
It’s the fight or flight response and 90% of people when given a bad review will quit, those who stay and learn from their mistakes become better employees.
I’ve had 2 disciplinaries myself in the ten years I’ve worked for my employer and at the time I felt like the world was coming at me but I came back and have fantastic reviews, figures and held in high regard by colleagues. No mistakes made nothing learnt.

I’ve been nosing about the company (it’s ****** by the way the baby murdering so and so’s)intranet and have found a copy of the performance management procedure none of which has been done. I’m sure this can only strengthen my case. My current thoughts are to reply to the email notifying me of the result on tuesday with a copy of the procedure and asking if my performance was so poor why was it not followed. I’m wondering if pushing them to offering a compromise agreement while still in may be easier than resigning, threatening a tribunal and trying to get something out of them.

rattrap – Officially they’ve done nothing since, I’ve had a few emails from him making comments but he’s not set up any official reviews, put in place an action plan or anything in writing to improve things.

Oh and with regard to the compromise agreement which is my preferred option to be honest, I definitely want out of there as the whole episode leaves a very bad taste in my mouth. I’m wondering if it’s better to be offered it by replying citing issues or to actually resign, notify a claim and see what they respond with.

pitchpro2011 – Member

First off your previous review is irrelevant, no buts. I did good last year but I can’t ride on the back of that and say my review this year should be medium instead of poor because last year was good.

It’s not “riding on the back of that”, and it’s certainly not irrelevant- it provides a baseline against which the following year’s performance can be understood. If the following review is substantially different, they would need to justify that.

if your going to be hung for a lamb

shit on his desk and go out a lion

ps on a more serious note if your doing ok in a blue chip you won’t struggle to find a new job in engineering there seems to be a shortage of good uns (engineers) at the mo

Ask for a meeting with your boss that gave you the bad review and hr together. Ask them outright why you weren’t given interim reviews with improvement measures, given the ultimate poor review. How could you be expected to think your performance is anything but good, when in your mind you are doing the same job as you have for prior years with prior good appraisals, and nothing advised to the contrary.

And then ask them what they want to do about it. Are you being given a clear set of improvement objectives to meet? If at this point they umm and ahhh because they haven’t thought about it, then push the point home – are they trying to effectively out you, in which case you find that unacceptable but if it’s what they want, then offer to talk about a compromise to suit you both.

My current thoughts are to reply to the email notifying me of the result on tuesday with a copy of the procedure and asking if my performance was so poor why was it not followed.

Question – you say you appealed, was this an appeal ‘to the line manager’ or an appeal that was done through HR?

I’d 100% recommend that if the formal procedure has not been followed, you need to launch a written grievance with HR, as per company grievance procedure (you’ve tried to deal with this informally, now its official and to HR)

I’m wondering if pushing them to offering a compromise agreement while still in may be easier than resigning, threatening a tribunal and trying to get something out of them.

Yes, much, much better if you can pull it off – however don’t disregard the possibility that this is manager acting on his own, and HR will get it resolved (though in my experience they often back the manager up whether he’s in the right or wrong, the drawback of ‘professional’ HR versus old fashioned personnel departments)

If at this point they umm and ahhh because they haven’t thought about it, then push the point home – are they trying to effectively out you, in which case you find that unacceptable but if it’s what they want, then offer to talk about a compromise to suit you both.

Very good advice!

A constructive dismissal claim is next to impossible to win, so if you want something out of it do not resign and claim constructive dismissal. Basically you would have to prove that working there was extremely damaging to you and every opportunity to resolve it had been taken. It’s there basically for when someone suffers frequent harassment and complaints to the management are just laughed off.

Pitch in for a compromise agreement and use the fact that they have not followed their own procedures to enhance that.

Going to a proper (not ambulance chaser no-win, no fee) solicitor may well help, but I suspect Nestle get solicitors letters every day of the week…

Go and see an experienced employment lawyer this sort of thing is their bread and butter and will be able to give all your options and how to get it sorted

The appeal was done through HR, although they played no part of it and my bosses boss conducted the review and advised me of the outcome. The one person I spoke to in HR about was a site based person not one responsible for group people, initially they said they’d deal with it, as soon as I outlined all that had happened they ran very quickly to hand it back to someone else. This gives me some hope that even they think what has happened wrong.
I’m thinking that the direct meeting approach and then rather than asking what they want to do suggest that as nothing has been done properly to this point that they want rid of me and that is unacceptable.

I’m well aware that actually winning a constructive dismissal case is hard and rare but I think that’s heavily based on the fact that most are settled before hand out of court, only those with a dubious case get that far, the more clear cut just never reach that stage.

What is it about this job that makes it worth staying?

If there are only poor alternative options your best bet is to stick it out, be super positive in asking for feedback and an improvement plan etc. and wait for the time to move to another job/area/business unit. I can see that it’s a matter of principle but is it worth the hassle?

Take this as a learning experience: always expect to get shafted, protect yourself against it and vow to never to it to anyone you manage.

Steveh, just perhaps by naming your employer ion public and washing your job wzaashing on a public forum, then just perhaps you may well be sacked, lots of firms dont like that sort of stuff.

Possibly a fair point project, thanks to the mods for removing.