I wondered if anyone knows if its true, or not, that if a landowner can demonstrate that a horse has not used the bridleway over land they own for a certain period of time, the landowner can have bridleway status lifted and the right of way closed? A landowner has this day informed me that that is their intention toward a track I recently discovered and rode for the first time.

Speak with your local ROW Officer.

Is there such a thing? where do they opperate from? thanks

Defo speak with your local ROW Officer! How is a landowner going to ‘demonstrate’ that a BW hasn’t been used by a horse FFS? CCTV 24/7 for the past 2 years?

Local county council office for your ROW Officer.

Wheres the trail? Sure we can contact local horse riding groups etc and explain/ask…and even a digital pic if required..

I asked that very question Essel.The landowner has put a locked gate across and a sign requesting that you call at the farm and they will open it for you.He says no horsemen have appeared and bikers and walkers use the style at the side.They have a diary and say that unless horseriders come forward and say they have ridden the track the diary stands as evidence.

if he was really planning to do this he wouldn’t have told you. My experience of RoW claims etc is that there tends to be a lot of secrecy to avoid getting stiffed by the other side.

as for the legality I’m not so sure, the local council uses the difficulty in extinguishing PRoW as part of the lack of urgency in clearing blocked ones

but just in case email the local horse riding groups and he’ll find it ridden

Where is this? Stick a link up to the track in question on streetmap.co.uk or similar. If in England or Wales your local rights of way officer is part of your county council, not sure about NI but presume the same. I reckon they’d be very interested in hearing about this, and keen to remind the “landowner” of their obligations to permit access if they are effectively discouraging or blocking legal use of the route, so look up their contact number and give them a ring.

(edit) and I imagine the local British Horse Society (BHS) would either know about this or be keen to know about this as they seem to be pretty hot on access issues (and up to speed with the legal side of things).

As a general rule, no, they absolutely can’t.

Routes can be extinguished where the authority considers that the path is no longer needed for public use. These are normally the only grounds on which an extinguishment order may be made. This may be, for example because other paths adequately serve the area.

Very rarely, the route is extinguished because the path, although available for use by the public, has not been used for a great many years, however the only times I’ve seen this in years has been where the route is a dead end, one I saw where a railway level crossing was closed for safety reasons on one side of the county line, leaving a dead end on the other (in the end they placed a TRO to prevent horse use instead) – but this would be exceptional. The fact that bikes and walkers are using it is enough to demonstrate that his claim has no merit.

Lack of use due to deliberate blockage of the path couldn’t constitute grounds for extinguishment – theres little doubt that what he’s done by locking the gate isn’t legal (pretty big case about gates and gateways recently) so I’d be on to the ROW department (or even go straight in with a S130A form to report the locked gate)

Edit: See here – http://www.iprow.co.uk/gpg/index.php/Section_130A_Process

This is all good sensible stuff.I’m beginning to feel informed.It’s certainly good to know the facts and,or,how to get them prior to argument or contest.

Report the Bridleway being blocked and see what happens, I did just that by twitter to the local paper and the next week the gate had been removed.

I did ask about the lock and the owner said it was locked as a result of abuse of the track by 4×4 users and motorbikes.I went for the gate to be opened because of crotch high nettles, style, short pants and curiosity.

gleeber – Member

The landowner has put a locked gate across and a sign requesting that you call at the farm and they will open it for you

missed this, go straight to the local PROW officer and report the locked gating of the bridleway, it’s an offence and he’ll get told to remove the lock

I would also send details to the Local Access Forum (a statutory body) where many worthies will then give the poor council guy a hard time about it (only joking), the issue will become “known” and the trail popular

In statutory terms what he’s done is the equivalent of blocking a public road, as the bridleway has the same status. Definitely a call to the local ROW officer.

By you going to the council and requesting it to be unblocked will put a clear spanner in the works if he ever tries to claim it is unused! It also makes the point that he has discouraged use.

And then follow it up if he hasn’t cleared the undergrowth to make it passable within a reasonable time 😆

Love the logic of saying to someone using the bridleway that it isn’t being used! 😯

I am using the track but the landowners point seems to be that it must still be used by horses to remain a bridleway Graham. Anyway I’m contacting the council today and feel quite confident armed with the bit’s of info. I’ve gathered. The track’s only 700 yards long but it joins several routes together. It’s the principle of the thing mainly. I want to know If this landowner’s claim is correct. It’s bugging me. Never realised how important horses and the equine fraternity are to off road biking! (assuming that the landowner’s right)

I imagine most cases of this someone buys a property/land. Is told by the Solicitor of the ROW etc etc. Decides they love the house/land and will sort out the problem..

Same as those who buy an old listed property on desirable land and decide to accidentally let the roof fall into disrepair then claim the structure is unsafe…

Never realised how important horses and the equine fraternity are to off road biking! (assuming that the landowner’s right)

They’re not. The opposite can apply if there’s historical evidence it was used with some regular occurrence by horses then it can become a bridleway.

Horses have nothing to do with it. A bridleway is a public thoroughfare and it will take a lot more than a locked gate to get one closed as it has to be done under the terms of the law. The same difficulty applies when trying to upgrade a footpath to bridleway status. Have a look at the website of the South Pennines Packhorse Trails Trust, which is linked on this website: http://www.rightsofway.org.uk/

Sounds like the landowner has been listening to too much nonsense down at the pub.

Now that’s interesting Drac! learning a lot here. I’m getting absorbed in this subject.

Is it about time the bridleway gets a flash mob?

What’s a flash mob Johndoh?

I suspect having bike riders ringing the bell and asking for the key about every twenty minutes may have a place in this, if the official process is taking a long time.

(edit) Whereabouts is it? You don’t have to be precise right now.

PS

One of the betterer flash mobs…

Talk to the local ramblers association too. Probably the best row advocates there are.

Also, can you post a link to the route – you’ve nothign to lose by doign that and if we can see where it is maybe other local riders can get involved?

Yeah,where is it? Don’t be coy.

The landowner has put a locked gate across and a sign requesting that you call at the farm and they will open it for you.

Any one up for a night ride – perhaps around 2am. Knock, knock, knock!

I am using the track but the landowners point seems to be that it must still be used by horses to remain a bridleway Graham

I’m 99% sure that’s bollocks (and I’m sure someone here or a PROW officer can fill in the remaining 1%).

^ indeed it is 🙂

As a RoW officer I can’t really add to what ninfan has already said; a highway can’t be lost by virtue of a lack of use (either deliberate or otherwise), or “once a highway, always a highway” as the old saying goes.

As mentioned, it’s worth highlighting the fact that by unlocking the gate when asked, he is in effect negating his own position of there being no path. What could be happening is the landowner could be confused with the so-called 20 year rule (see presumed dedication) by preventing rights from being claimed on a route that isn’t public but is being used, but again, by allowing the public to use it he’s once more shooting himself in the foot.

I think GrahamS said it better though: –

Love the logic of saying to someone using the bridleway that it isn’t being used!

Is it a new gate? IME it’ll be illegal anyway as in this instance it would only allowed for the ‘ingress / egress of animals for agricultural purposes’ (or words to that effect) so needs what’s called a ‘gate license’, and even then by asking for one he’s admitting to it being a BW. If it’s an old one then it needs unlocking anyway, and permanently BTW, not by asking for the key.

99% of the time I’d suggest not serving a S130 notice, but sometimes it’s needed to give someone awkward a swift boot up the harris.

So yes, as mentioned above, report it to your local PRoW team and ask what they intend to do.

Schnor, Got one to throw at you

OS shows an ORPA

older maps showing it as:

So, I queried with the council (highways rather than PROW) – the unuseful answer I’ve had back is that the route is classed as them as not maintainable at public expense, and that ‘the nature and extent of highway rights, if any, over Frith Hill Road, is uncertain’, on querying this, they said that when they (county) took responsibility back in from borough, there was no evidence that it was maintainable… so they view it as a private street… however its blocked at both ends with a steel barrier preventing vehicles.

I’ve gone back to them and pointed out that that does not add up, as the existence of three bridleways and a footpath which terminate on the route indicates that it must carry highway rights, as otherwise they have no legal termination. they’ve shrugged shoulders and said that they must have drafted wrong by incorrectly assuming it was a highway.

I’ve also checked OS First edition, and there’s no trace of it…

Of course I also pointed out to them that this was turning into a pressing problem, as cyclists in the area were being threatened with prosecution for riding on MOD land, as this is, so it was unacceptable to leave the issue unresolved… They’ve gone away to discuss with PROW department, but I have to admit to being pretty stumped.

hora – Member
I imagine most cases of this someone buys a property/land. Is told by the Solicitor of the ROW etc etc. Decides they love the house/land and will sort out the problem..

Same as those who buy an old listed property on desirable land and decide to accidentally let the roof fall into disrepair then claim the structure is unsafe…
I had exactly this situation way back when I started riding byways and bridlepaths around Castle Combe. I used one that went from Nettleton past a building called Truckle Hill Barn. Anyway, one day I found a locked gate across the bridleway, which went right past the building, with a second one the other side, along with a freshly laid patch of dirt with grass growing between them.
As it happened, the owner was there, (newly restored building, owner city-type just moved out to the country…) so I asked about it. He said the gates were to protect his freshly laid lawn, and I had no right to ride a bike there anyway!
Que red rag time! I informed him that it was a bridlepath, and that I had a legal right to ride a bike along it, and he shouldn’t have locked gates preventing horses from going through.
‘No, I don’t think you have a right to ride a bike here’, and he didn’t want horses cutting up his new lawn either.
The following day I phoned the ROW officer in Trowbridge, and explained what had happened; “thank you very much”, he said, “that explains the irate phone calls from the local farmers who have been complaining to me about horses riding over their land where they have no right to be. There will be a letter on its way to him this afternoon!”
I went back there a couple of weeks later, gates unlocked, grass replaced by gravel, result!
Bloody townie scum!