Just looking for a sanity barometer here – Ms Scruff & I are planning a surfing, kayaking & cycling adventure holiday on Skye & Outer Hebrides this summer.

Accommodation wise we’ll either be taking our 3 man dome tent (small) or the big 5m bell tent. Bell tent will necessitate taking a trailer.

Idle browsing at work today has shown that 2 berth caravans come up very cheap @ ~ £1k if not less.

Extra ferry costs are same as taking the bell tent w/trailer @ £30 extra so negligible.

Whilst last time I visited the Hebrides the weather was glorious, we could well end up with pish for a few weeks and a caravan may be a nicer place than a small tent…

Is it a terrible idea to contemplate taking a cheap caravan over to the outer Hebrides for a holiday with potentially selling at end of holiday if doesn’t work out?

We briefly looked at hiring a camper van but costs are extortionate!

Caravan.
You’ll sell it for whatever you payed for it.

Is it a terrible idea to contemplate taking a cheap caravan over to the outer Hebrides for a holiday with potentially selling at end of holiday if doesn’t work out?

No, it sounds like a good idea.

Would the slower speeds on roads annoy you ?
If not a cheap caravan should be perfect as long as your old enough to tow it and cars up to it

Slower speed regardless if towing a trailer. Idea is sound.

Get some midge netting for the door and it will be a much nicer place to be than the bell tent (which normally aren’t very insect proof!)

Sounds like a very practical idea!

Road width maybe an issue as caravan s tend to be wider than cars and trailers same width or narrower.

P.s make sure you get the extra wing mirrors. Don’t be one of these **** in a 4×4 with no extra mirrors reliying on the little bit at the end of the standard mirror that pokes out beyond the car and.

“Would the slower speeds on roads annoy you”
You’ll be surprised about the number of times you’re stuck behind someone else.

Extension mirrors that stick out the same width as the caravan, tells you how close to the hedge the caravan is.

But yes its a good idea, makes stopping on the way up easy. The first time you drive on to the site when its going dark and raining…. I’ll just drop the legs down, then we’ll get a brew on:-)

Caravan, no brainer.

If it’s nice, sit outside, if it’s lashing down, sit looking out the window at the ones in tents, with a big smug grin.

Caravans are brilliant. Far better than a tent. The first rainy day you pitch up, brew up at a proper cooker, with fresh milk, and sit at a real table to.drink it cost and dry, you’ll love it 🙂

Re cost, yes two birth caravans are very cheap. Some tips:

– try and buy one from real owners who’ve holudayed in it. “Selling on behalf of someone else” can mean they have patched it up dodgily to flog.

– if there’s an awning and water bottles and such, this can reinforce the genuine credentials.

– Press the walls in every corner under the seats and in cupboards. If it’s soft, it’s damp.

– use your nose when you go in. If it smells damp, walk away.

– learn to read the age codes on tyres. Caravan tyres never wear out, they just get old, perish and eventually burst. If the tyres are over 7 years old, avoid.

Lots more buying advice if you decide to go for it. If buying on eBay share some links and we’ll help 🙂

Also get roof racks for the boats and bikes. Pain in the arse to put them in the caravan and they’ll trash the interior.

Well, that’s fairly resounding agreement.

As for the weight and towing regs, it would appear so long as the all up train weight is <3,500kg I’ll be within the law. The ‘vans I’ve seen are of the ~750kg ball park so come well under the limit.

Will spend the next few months doing some research.

Thanks all

All up train weight? It’s not quite that simple. Gross Caravan shouldn’t be more than about 85% of the weight of the car. Exceed that at your peril!

All this talk of caravans & campers heading our way reminds me that it’s soon going to be 40mph season 😥

I try not to hold anyone up while towing, not unless they want to exceed the limit anyway. 😉

You’ve picked the most expensive time of year to buy but it was the caravan show last weekend so should be plenty of trade ins at the dealers over the next few months. Might be worth a trawl around the dealers.

It sounds like you’ve got a post-97 license?

The plated maximum weights should be 3500kg or under. AND…
Max plated weight of caravan must be less than the unladen weight of the car.

Or you can drive a vehicle with a gros weight of 3500kg, plus a 750kg trailer.

The madness of the rules is you could be compliant towing a mid sized caravan behind a Mondeo, but a more capable and heavier 4×4 would be illegal as there is less allowance for towing. Although technically heavier, in reality it is an easier and safer combination to drive.

In the last few years the licensing has changed again to make it even more stringent.

It’s complicated and no one seems to know what they can tow… They should have made it simple by just limiting the gross weight of a trailer to 1200kg or so and be done with it!

Edit: Good idea, and buy privately, and not from a stealer…Especially when you are at the budget end of the scale. All the extras add up so try and get wheel clamp, gas and water bottles, hookup lead, step etc all thrown in.

We’ve got a t@b 320. Which is great same width and length as the passat and slightly smaller than the t6 well be using this year (yeah I know #middleclasstravellingtypes). So so so much easier than the tent. Happy to drive at the lower speed just pull over if a queue behind. Laugh at the knob who must overtake caravan but sits at 45 after doing so.

If it’s nice, sit outside, if it’s lashing down, sit looking out the window at the ones in tents, with a big smug grin.

What an odd thing to admit to.
And why does Molgrips think you can’t have fresh milk if you’re a camperist?
Scenario of a camperist:
Drive at normal speeds and arrive fresh because you haven’t got stressed knowing the rest of the driving world hates you.
Get tent out and pitch in 30 seconds, or less.
Enjoy the extra 2 hours of holiday.
Watch caravanners get soaking wet while as they argue about who’s going to put the legs down and put the awning up.
Look on bemused as they struggle to reverse the tin tent.
Get a cold beer from the fridge.
Enjoy.

Caravan shit is expensive .

Based on what I’m up to just now .

I underestimated what things cost. Lucky a few of the things I bargained on were cheaper to fix than expected.

But the habitation heater was 230 quid for a little PCB.

A bunk ladder was 50 quid

Caravan electric shit is expensive…….Lucky I know enough about electrics to be dangerous and can build my own looms up from basic components. 6 quid of components becomes 60 quid if you put the word caravan infront of it.

Buy with open eyes.

As I understand it, unlike a motorhome/camper/tent, you can’t wild caravan, however the idea of a decent fixed base sounds ideal.

Practice reversing for singletrack road meets

“As for the weight and towing regs, it would appear so long as the all up train weight is <3,500kg I’ll be within the law”, as I’m looking at caravans I think it’s a bit more complex:
– max 85% weight ratio recommended (caravan to car weights)
– caravan noseweight on towbar limit (car has a stated limit)
– car towing limit weight (stated on the car)
– 40hp per tonne recommendation.
– caravan weight/mro and mtplm (ie what it weights empty and how much you can load into it)

oh yeah, can’t use outside lane on 3 lane mway and lower speed limits apply

Your neighbours will hate you when you park a crap old shed on the driveway that devalues house prices by 15% over a 10 house radius :wink:.

Make sure you check the available payload in the ‘van – some are pitifully small like less than a 100kg. Soon eaten up with gas bottles, food, clothes etc. Bikes & Canoe kit will need to go in the car!

If not a cheap caravan should be perfect as long as your old enough to tow it and cars up to it

Unlikely a 2 berth caravan will tip the weight of vehicle and van of 3500kg.

Yep van is a good idea, but a £1k van isn’t likely to be that nice a place to be, probably damp and a bit musty.

max 85% weight ratio recommended (caravan to car weights

The 85% ratio is a recommenced match only, you can tow up to 100% of car towing ‘weight’. Its not a legal requirement

Caravans are brilliant. Far better than a tent. The first rainy day you pitch up, brew up at a proper cooker, with fresh milk, and sit at a real table to.drink it cost and dry, you’ll love it

I can do all that in my tent, which at 8m long, gives me way more space than a caravan. You save an hour on arrival because you don’t have to pitch a tent, I save an hour driving there because I don’t have to tow a caravan.

The 85% ratio is a recommenced match only, you can tow up to 100% of car towing ‘weight’. Its not a legal requirement

It’s a recommendation for good reason even more so when the user normally doesn’t tow very often.

[Quote]I save an hour driving there because I don’t have to tow a caravan.[/quote]

Very little chance of it raining in the car when he’s driving too and from the site which on West of Scotland there’s a good chance you’ll get wet while pitching and striking.

And why does Molgrips think you can’t have fresh milk if you’re a camperist?

I’ve extensively camped as well as caravanned. Milk tends not to keep that well without a fridge.

Get tent out and pitch in 30 seconds, or less.
Enjoy the extra 2 hours of holiday.
Watch caravanners get soaking wet while as they argue about who’s going to put the legs down and put the awning up.

I think you are comparing efficient camping with inefficient caravanning. You may be able to pitch a tiny instant pitch tent in 30 seconds, but the two things are in no way comparable. Trust me, I do know this. Did you know that caravan awnings are not mandatory, and for shorts stays most people don’t bother?

You can get packing up from camping down to a similar amount of time as packing up a caravan, but then you have to spend your holiday in a little tiny tent with no facilities and cook on the floor. Of course, you can bring a fridge, table kitchen, folding cupboards, folding beds etc etc, but that stuff isn’t all going to be got out and packed away in 30 seconds, is it?

Plus, no caravanner is going to be standing around outside in the rain putting an awning up. We sit in our nice warm van until it stops, obviously. And why would caravanners be more likely to argue than a couple in a tent? I think you are talking arse.

Get a cold beer from the fridge.

Is this the fridge that magically unpacked itself in the 30 seconds your tent takes to erect? Or is it a carvanner’s fridge which is already there and cold?

Caravan shit is expensive .

Spares can be, but they can also be cheap. I found it very useful that you can usually get replace,ent interior fittings for peanuts: hinges, door catches, new keys, rubber sealing strips, lights, plumbing etc etc. Yes, things like a new fridge from a breakers are much more than you expect, but then when you can buy a complete van for a grand it starts to look like good value.

Yep van is a good idea, but a £1k van isn’t likely to be that nice a place to be, probably damp and a bit musty.

I wouldn’t say ‘probably’. There are crap vans for sale at that price but also good ones. They are definitely around. You can get decent old vans from dealers but they are three times the price.

Make sure you check the available payload in the ‘van – some are pitifully small like less than a 100kg.

Modern vans it’s usually about 130kg or so, not including a gas bottle usually. There’s MIRO (mass in running order) and MTPLM (maximum technical permissible laden mass). Payload is MTPLM – MIRO, and MIRO includes a gas bottle (since 2011 anyay). Older vans though have much more generous allowance, perhaps for this reason. My 23 year old Bailey 4 berth 18ft van is 850kg MIRO and 1080kg MTPLM I think, which is pretty light and also gives a lot of payload.

Still – even 130kg is a lot of clothes and food.

I can do all that in my tent, which at 8m long, gives me way more space than a caravan. You save an hour on arrival because you don’t have to pitch a tent, I save an hour driving there because I don’t have to tow a caravan.

What I meant was, I can do it all immediately, without having to pitch a tent in the rain and unpack and setup all the furniture and cookers. It’s already there.

As I said – I’ve done both, a lot, and caravanning is better in many circumstances. Except the driving. But on balance, caravanning is better for me.

It’s also worth pointing out that the caravan can stay packed, which I find a little more convenient.

I think there is a little animosity between campers and caravanners on this thread. Which is pretty stupid, isn’t it?

I can do all that in my tent, which at 8m long, gives me way more space than a caravan. You save an hour on arrival because you don’t have to pitch a tent, I save an hour driving there because I don’t have to tow a caravan.

It’s a recommendation for good reason even more so when the user normally doesn’t tow very often.

It’s good for an inexperienced tower with an old van. Modern car/modern van with al-ko stability control then its not so important.

I can do all that in my tent, which at 8m long, gives me way more space than a caravan. You save an hour on arrival because you don’t have to pitch a tent, I save an hour driving there because I don’t have to tow a caravan.

Experienced tentist and experienced caravanist. I love going away in the tent but the van is roughly speaking a million times better.

What do you think the ops going to get for 1k – you’ll be looking at 10times that(without looking at actual prices just a stab in the dark) before your getting something with alko stabiliser system which is very neat.

Some folk I know have bought sub 1k vans and got a steal. Others have bought waterproof floors with porous roofs……

What do you think the ops going to get for 1k

Same as I got for £1k. Old, hilarous decor but dry and comfy 2 berth van with all the gadgets working including hitch stabiliser. Mine also had two awnings and all the accoutriments, which I nicked for its 4 berth replacement. Also nicked the hitch stabiliser 🙂

Not man enough for a tent?
Too poor for a hotel?

Buy a caravan! And ensure every other motorist hates you. 😀

What do you think the ops going to get for 1k – you’ll be looking at 10times that(without looking at actual prices just a stab in the dark) before your getting something with alko stabiliser system which is very neat.

One with a hitch stabiliser going by molgrips post. Alko ATC system has been around for at least 10 years.

But I’m well aware of what the op will get for £1k.

I’ve had caravans for 10+ years, toured a lot around Europe and would generally choose a tin tent over canvas / nylon everytime. However, one of the few places I wouldn’t want to take a caraven is the Scottish islands. I’m not saying you couldnt’t, but the thought of trying to thread a car and caravan around some of the narrowest lanes in the UK could be very stressfull and pretty much spoil the holiday IMO.

Minor thread hijack. Are caravan awnings suitable for sleeping in? E.g. If we got a 2 berth and the kids slept in the awning area?

Yes awnings are fine for sleeping in, you can add an inner tent if you want or just stick camp beds in the awning.

Are caravan awnings suitable for sleeping in? E.g. If we got a 2 berth and the kids slept in the awning area?

Yes. My in-laws slept in ours as we slept in the van.

However you have to put the awning up then,and if your 2 berth is small you lose a lot of awning space you could otherwise eat or play in etc. Inner tents are easy to take down and stash away though. I’d recommend an inner tent, as you can be rudeley awakened by beasties – or just not awakend at all whilst they feast on you.

Also consider a cheap 2-man tent for them to sleep in – easier and quicker than awning. Or just a 4 berth van.

And ensure every other motorist hates you

There are things you can do to avoid pissing motorists off. I pull over regularly to let people by, and I also choose routes to maximise dual carriageway/motorway. Also when there’s a straight you can back off to let people come by.

On windy A roads I’ve found that I can drive fast enough to not be the hold-up anyway. Particularly around Somerset, where there’s always far more dawdlers than there is caravanners.

Or just a 4 berth van.

Yeah, just seems like 2 berths tend to be much better value.

Yeah, just seems like 2 berths tend to be much better value.

Yeh but they’re pretty small for fitting a family in.

They’re cheaper, yes, but they are only better value if they do what you want 🙂

I think you’ll regret the faff of having to put up an awning or tent every time. Also 2 berth vans only have one dinette. We got a 4 berth for £1500 which did need work, admittedly, but I know of other people who paid less and got much better vans so they are out there.

Having two dinettes is great for us – the kids play on the little table, their toys and games are in the cupboards there, and we get to relax on the big seats. It really helps. Ideally I’d want an end dinette, so they can be at the other end of the van and have more space still.

Rainy caravan day – kids playing nicely out of shot to the left, everyone warm, comfy and dry.

caravans are great.
I also couldn’t give care less if other people hate me. I hate them.

I’m normally towing at the same speed as the car in front. In spite of this no end of Clarkson-worshipping bellends decide they ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO OVERTAKE BECAUSE THE MERE PRESENCE OF A CARAVAN means that they’ll more than likely slow down so much that they’ll be reported missing by their loved ones.