Having spent my childhood laughing at milk floats and their slow progress this seems like a massive change in how we see vehicles being propelled.

Clearly there will be internal combustion engines in Volvo’s after 2019 but it seems such a short time until they’re not the only source of power.

I think diesel sales will fall off a cliff soon, the low speed torque of electric motors negates one of the big advantages of diesels and with EV ranges now approaching 200+ miles at a very low cost/mile the economy of the diesel becomes irrelevant for most journeys under 3 hours.

[link appears not to be pay walled]

https://www.ft.com/content/471cd6e2-60bc-11e7-91a7-502f7ee26895

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volvocars-geely-electric-idUSKBN19Q0BJ

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/07/05/volvo-becomes-first-major-car-manufacturer-go-electric/

Odd, I got the full article twice when I originally picked it up, now paywalled. Darn.

I tried out a Nissan Leaf a week or so ago (Car Club vehicle), normally I’d use one of their Fiestas or Priuses. I was very impressed, the performance of the Leaf was so much better than either the ICE or the Hybrid. I can see where Volvo are coming from.

Still sounds like a milk float, but drives like a normal car.

In full pedant mode regarding the title of the thread I’d say that almost every car on sale has numerous electric motors already,( I gave up counting at 10 on my Golf) so it could be argued that Volvo already have reached that point.

Electric Traction motors are a different thing.

Many people don’t have easy access to overnight charging and in town centres are unlikely to get access soon, so range extender EV’s are surely going to become more important.

Yup its the future. Always was but DieselGate has helped it along. IMO we’ll see more and more Hybrids with full electric takeup following later, possibly quite a bit later.

Electric is definitely the future.

I’ve oft wondered what my daughter’s first car will be – she’s 3½ so it’s a while yet – and just the other day it struck me that it is quite likely to be an EV. I’d never even considered the idea before. The way tech has moved in the last 10-15 years, another 10-15 and combustion engines will probably be reserved for specialist applications, and weird beardy folk with their classic cars.

<waves at future self>

So every Volvo model will be available with Hybrid power. Not the same as only available with Hybrid power. Marketing genius

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/07/05/volvo-becomes-first-major-car-manufacturer-go-electric/

Good, the sooner the combustion engine leave the world the better we will all be.

Been in heaps of hybrids recently and it’s hard to tell the difference as a passenger, also seeing a lot more motels out here in Oz with charging points.

It will take some bold action and a serious look at electricity generation but worth it in the end

jimw got my pedant response in first 😆

Cheers, Rich

Volvo will become the first major car manufacturer to go all electric, with the Swedish company saying that every car in its range will have an electric power train available from 2019.

I wonder whether Tesla will be counted as a major car manufacturer by 2019?

IMO electric cars drive better than ICE. I had a Nissan Leaf for a week on a test drive and it was great. Only downside being range anxiety. I am not a petrol head so getting from A to B to is all that matters to me. The smoother and less stressful the bit in the middle is the better. My 7 speed Merc does this perfectly but at 35-40 mpg it is not the most cost effective car.

the low speed torque of electric motors negates one of the big advantages of diesels until the battery runs down

FTFY
I think sales of larger vehicles in diesel format will not fall of a cliff particularly soon, but smaller cars will def feel the pinch in the next few years.
We have a diesel Golf which used to be our main car and did a suitably high mileage, but now it’s just used to for a 20 mile round trip each day so it’s time for it to go and be replaced by a petrol.
TBH though the only thing that bothers me about dieselgate is the fact fact that the VW ‘fix’ on our car has made it worse to drive.

I’d be very happy to have an electric vehicle.

Many people don’t have easy access to overnight charging

That’s changing though. I know multiple people in my village that have electric charging points on their driveway. Some of them don’t even have electric cars, but got them installed because it was offered for free as some OLEV grant scheme.

e.g. http://www.electricnation.org.uk/2017/02/21/installation-of-free-smart-chargers-gets-underway-for-electric-vehicle-owners/

We also have public charging points in the local car park.

I’ve oft wondered what my daughter’s first car will be

I bet she won’t own a car.
It’s a pointless venture when you think about it.
Cars spend most of their time sat, empty, taking up a car shaped space somewhere.

What’ll happen is you NEVER own a car. You just ‘summon’ the car you want, at that time.
You’ll click “family SUV” in an app, anda self driving family SUV will turn up, you’ll drive it to camp in the new forest fully loaded, and then unload. The car will then drive away.
You’ll then get fed up of the kids, click “2 seater sports car”, and one’ll turn up which you’ll raz to the pub. It’ll drive away…
You’ll have a few drinks, feel flash, click “bently” and a posh car will drive you back hom (in fact, you’ll have dozed off in the rear seat, missing the joy)…

THen, when it’s time to go home, you’ll call up the crappy family SUV again….

You’ll have been using a car for all of 5 hours over a 7 day period, ant it will be cheaper and betterer for everyone…

DrP

A drive? That’s nice.

How does that work in cities then or towns with no off street parking?

I’d sooner see less cars myself…

DrP I think you are living in dream land unless you live in London, people like personal freedom and to ‘own’ stuff, and need to get to work etc. If people wanted to rent cars it’s perfectly possible to do that now, and I know a few people who don’t own a car and rent only when necessary.

Self driving cars are miles off from being acceptable in towns and cities, simply because they can’t cope with things like cyclists, dogs, children etc. In fact I’d go so far as to say we’ll never see them, as the legislation will be such that a person will need to be present to over rule the computer if need be.

I want to live in DrPs world!

FWIW, I think it is possible, car clubs etc. in London are huge, congestion in urban areas is progressively getting worse. We need more space on the roads, less on street parking etc. the only way to do this in these areas is reducing car ownership (not necessarily even car journeys themselves). People change their behaviour when forced to, and the current situation is unsustainable.

I’ve oft wondered what my daughter’s first car will be – she’s 3½ so it’s a while yet

Interesting assumption. It might be that that question will make as much sense in the future as asking what her first bus, train or airliner will be.

Edit. Point already made.

“Reduction in carbon footprint”

Yer, riiiiight.

squirrelking – Member
A drive? That’s nice.

How does that work in cities then or towns with no off street parking?

I’d sooner see less cars myself…

Lamp posts with charging points, charging points added at the kerb. Numerous possibilities.

dragon – Member
Self driving cars are miles off from being acceptable in towns and cities, simply because they can’t cope with things like cyclists, dogs, children etc. In fact I’d go so far as to say we’ll never see them, as the legislation will be such that a person will need to be present to over rule the computer if need be.

It’s a weirdly arrogant view to think humans are the only things which can possibly drive a car. Computers will do it (far) better than humans and it’s not far off.

Already we have things like Tesla’s emergency collision detection which is better than what a human can do.

Have a look at this, it brakes before the collision ahead occurs, and it knows whats going on by bouncing radar or laser under the car in front.
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Kti-9qsLpc[/video]

How does that work in cities then or towns with no off street parking?

Depends on your city I guess. Looks like my nearest city Newcastle currently has 551 public charging locations.
https://www.zap-map.com/location-search/?pc=Newcastle&ll=54.9783%252C-1.6178

And plans to increase that:
https://www.newcastle.gov.uk/parking-roads-and-transport/travel-planning/electric-vehicle-charging-points

There might be numerous possibilities for charging points, but leccy won’t be a future until those possibilities are implemented.

I live in a town centre, on 4th floor, no drive. Where do I charge my car?

When there’s a charging point in every single lamp post, street sign, etc. and a charging point between every 2 bays in practically every single car park (not just 8 bays next to the disabled parking on the ground floor), then it might be a future.

For UK, where sub-urban semi detached with a 1-2 car driveway is more common, it might be a future there.

When there’s a charging point in every single lamp post, street sign, etc. and a charging point between every 2 bays in practically every single car park (not just 8 bays next to the disabled parking on the ground floor), then it might be a future.

Or quick chargers in every current fuel station?

Or wireless charging imbedded in the roads you drive on?

Or replaceable battery packs available in fuel stations?

Technology moves on too quick in this area, energy transfer and battery capacity is getting faster and bigger respectively. The EV industry is now recommending that trickle charging be phased out due to it taking 14+ hours to charge a normal EV these days! Interesting times…

Oh and of all the main carparks in this city, only 1 afaik has some bays with charging capability (edit: it’s 1 charging point for 3000 bays?).
The best bit… you have to go to the office to get a token to operate the charging point, which is open 8 til 8 on working days only! For a 24/7 carpark.
It is A future, not THE future, right now.

edit: the main out of town has whoa… 4 charging bays for cars, and 4 charging bays for electric mopeds. the future is nearly here.

“I bet she won’t own a car.“

I bet she will. Unless you’re being utterly pedantic about me paying for it meaning I own it 🙂

Electric cars reach record 42% of Norway’s total new car sales with boost from Tesla Model X

It’s very possible that very few people will own cars, with big car parks filled with autonomous vehicles which you’ll just summon via an ap

dawn-of-the-driverless-car

This is a good watch – it’s not all good news but it should be a lot better than it is now.

As said, unless there is a charging point literally anywhere you can park a car then it’s not practicable. The problem with that though, is that it would be expensive and that’s before you try to figure out where you are going to get the power from (we’re already in enough trouble trying to keep the lights on without adding to it at this stage). Electric isn’t even necessarily the answer anyway, there are other solutions that are far more practical at this point in time (but don’t really address car culture)

As said, the real solution is to get rid of peoples dependency on cars. Integrated public transport that is cheap and convenient would get rid of a lot of problems whilst car club schemes could fill in the gaps (self driving or otherwise). I’m the first to admit I’m dependant on my car and it’s not something I’m particularly happy about but there’s not a whole lot I can really do about it at this stage.

Yes, people like owning cars but in all honesty how many people who care about such things actually own their car? I bet a sizeable proportion of folk on here have a lease or company car. This whole phenomenon is built on prestige and the debt-ingrained society we are living in which, at some point, will have to end.

I can certainly imagine a future (or even a present) where you have a charge point at home and another in your parking space at work.

That make an electric vehicle ideal for commutes and the average car journey (which is just 22 minutes!)

Have a look at this, it brakes before the collision ahead occurs, and it knows whats going on by bouncing radar or laser under the car in front.

Good that. But then it sits in the fast lane waiting to get rear ended. 😉

For every petrol engine taken off the streets there are ten petrol-driven leaf blowers lurking in the shadows.

It’s a weirdly arrogant view to think humans are the only things which can possibly drive a car. Computers will do it (far) better than humans and it’s not far off.

Hardly when most of the big tech and car companies are saying they are struggling to get it to work in towns and cities, due to the erratic behaviour of pedestrians, cyclists etc.

That Tesla vid yeah is great, but it’s on a segregated dual carriageway and that’s about the easiest situation for an automated car (or human) to work. For driverless cars to work they will need to go through towns and cities, past schools, shopping centers, playing fields.

I can certainly imagine a future (or even a present) where you have a charge point at home and another in your parking space at work.

So can I. The problem is I don’t have a driveway or even a place I can consistently leave my car.

It probably wouldn’t surprise you either to learn that despite installing public EV chargers the company I work for has precisely zero on a site that can accommodate up to 1000 people at a time.

enfht – I don’t think leaf blowers are a great concern in the grand scheme of things, they tend not to run particularly often.

dragon – you forgot baby robins.

What’ll happen is you NEVER own a car. You just ‘summon’ the car you want, at that time.
You’ll click “family SUV” in an app, anda self driving family SUV will turn up, you’ll drive it to camp in the new forest fully loaded, and then unload. The car will then drive away.
You’ll then get fed up of the kids, click “2 seater sports car”, and one’ll turn up which you’ll raz to the pub. It’ll drive away…
You’ll have a few drinks, feel flash, click “bently” and a posh car will drive you back hom (in fact, you’ll have dozed off in the rear seat, missing the joy)…

THen, when it’s time to go home, you’ll call up the crappy family SUV again….

I want to live in that world I just don’t think it’s coming any time soon.

Self drive cars are a bit like Fusion power it’s been ‘just about to happen’ for ages but never actually arrives.

I’m fully converted to the EV car now.

Had a Nissan Leaf for over six months now, drives very well, won’t be getting a petrol or diesel car again.

I realise it’s not for everyone, but it would suit a lot of people .

There are plans to introduce street charging, won’t happen soon, but will happen in the major cities.

Our car energy costs have plummeted, and it is much cheaper than diesel or petrol.

There is a government grant where you can have a 7kw charger installed on your drive , costs £99.

Fortunately we have invested in lowering our electricity costs by having solar panels, and now a Tesla Powerwall 2 battery.
The battery stores the excess solar energy without it being exported to the grid.
Still get the same feed in tariff whether the energy is exported to the grid or stored in a battery.

There is a video on You Tube about the on street charging, existing lamp posts and street lighting are going to be used. This will begin to make quite a difference to the availability for people to charge who don’t have off street parking.

Believe it is on Richard Llewelyn Fully Charged channel.

dragon – Member
Hardly when most of the big tech and car companies are saying they are struggling to get it to work in towns and cities, due to the erratic behaviour of pedestrians, cyclists etc.

That Tesla vid yeah is great, but it’s on a segregated dual carriageway and that’s about the easiest situation for an automated car (or human) to work. For driverless cars to work they will need to go through towns and cities, past schools, shopping centers, playing fields.

Just a matter of time, dragon.

Google have clocked up over 2 million miles testing their autonomous cars in California and somewhere else I’ve forgotten and the number of cases where humans have had to take control has decreased fairly rapidly.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-38839071

The number of human interventions in journeys made by driverless cars from Google company Waymo in California more than halved in 2016.
There were only 124 “disengagement” incidents last year, where a driver had to take control of a test vehicle on public roads, down from 341 in 2015.
The cars drove nearly 636,000 miles last year, compared with just over 424,000 in 2015.

If I understand some of the latest tech.

We may be able to refill the electricity, into batteries, as a charged fluid in the next decade ( or so )

Volvo will become the first major car manufacturer to go all electric, with the Swedish company saying that every car in its range will have an electric power train available from 2019.

Volvo is a Chinese company and the batteries will be from the 7 day shop 😆