Now it looks like Minimum Alcohol Pricing will finally be going ahead in Scotland has anyone considered opening up a big new off-licence on the English side of the border?

Where is the English parliament on this now anyway? IIRC Cameron was in favour of the idea but seemed to be waiting to see if Scotland could get the go ahead from the European courts. Is May likely to be interested in improving the health of the nation rather than giving in to the drinks companies? Actually don’t bother error answering that last one…..

Wait until brexit/Scottish independence then you can start a proper smuggling business (not sure which way the profit will be?)

I can cycle to Berwick in 2.5 hours. Anyone need any gin?

The English (there’s a trend here) or UK parliament is probably against introducing more ( highly ) regressive taxes. They are leaving that to left of centre parties (!!) instead.

Scotroutes, as I understand it only really cheap nasty stuff will be affected – essentially like the sort of cider sold in 3L bottles that has white in the name and which isn’t actually made from fermented apples… the market for those is largely the buy today drink today consumer so your market will be very limited for cross border shopping.

Now it might however be a good time to open a homebrew shop!

Scotroutes, as I understand it only really cheap nasty stuff will be affected – essentially like the sort of cider sold in 3L bottles that has white in the name and which isn’t actually made from fermented apples… the market for those is largely the buy today drink today consumer so your market will be very limited for cross border shopping.

Which Iguess means that having a mobile shop bringing the booze to your doorway isn’t going to work either. Or is it?

I think the scotch whisky association will challenge it again, which I don’t really understand, it must have cost them a fortune so far.

Carlisle isn’t that far over the border at this side.

I expect a lot of booze cruise action in Asda. They’ll have get plenty of Bucky in though.

I think the scotch whisky association will challenge it again, which I don’t really understand, it must have cost them a fortune so far.

Deep pockets and lots of foreign investment probably driving it

Westminster probably backed off due to the SWA

How do Nicola’s new best friends in the EU view this decision?

So a left of centre, pro-EU party support a regressive policy that is against EU rules. You have to love Scottish politics.

Like Sweden?

#jambafacts #posttruthpost

All that’ll happen is folk will pay more for some drinks and/or they’ll drink better ‘quality’ stuff for the same price.

England doesn’t have to worry as much because they have far less of an alcohol problem. Scotland drinks more than the rest of the UK, with the central belt the worst. Also Scots drink more spirits than anyone else.

So yep if you live in Carlisle there is defo a business op for anyone not fussed about the health of Scotland.

SNP in haven’t-thought-it-through-properly shocker.

I live about 5 miles from the Border. Since the SNP and Greens are determined to take my land from me eventually, maybe I should get back into cross border raiding and smuggling, just like my ancestors did, in order to keep my pockets lined with silver (or whatever).

I assume you have been following the story and it’s nuances Scottie, even though you have not share your reasoning with us. You will be aware of where the debate lies too, I am sure ie, whether other options are available eg tax and where the ECJ stood on the matter and why the SWA have fought against the SNP here.

Or perhaps your oddly worded OP with reference to an English Parliament – whatever that is – suggest differently. Haven forbid another anti-English slur in an Indy thread…. 😉

#ySBS

From December for context

The European court has ruled that the Scottish government’s plan to impose a blanket minimum price for alcohol is in breach of EU free-trade laws.

Admittedly the debate was then referred to the national courts.

I presume that if you delivered by mail order from England, then it would be under English law, so I wonder if you set up a website based in England, with same day deliveries from a Scottish distribution hub, then would the transaction be under English rules or Scottish minimum price rules? Now that could be a goer. Mopeds razzing around like dominos pizza delivering booze within the hour.

Why bother with delivery?

#witheufriendslikethesewhoneedsenemies

Now that could be a goer. Mopeds razzing around like dominos pizza delivering booze within the hour.

I think it more likely to take the model used for selling bootleg tobacco- standing in the Barra’s shouting ‘TOBACCO!’ in a jacket stuffed full of fags.

The only additional investment in infrastructure need to scale this model of distribution up for booze is a coat with bigger pockets.

Minimum pricing as stated will hit the cheap crap that rates on the most pissed/pound scale first. It will probably also catch some of the supermarket wine deals about but not much more. Unless you just over the border and are a regular in those things it’s not going to impact you much. Otherwise nipping to the massive tesco/asda in Carlisle will probably beat any back shed operation.

It will hit the cheap crap.

However…

What will it do to the price of the good stuff? It sure as hell won’t sit a few quid off the price of the crap that’s for sure, have to maintain a premium image you know.

England doesn’t have to worry as much because they have far less of an alcohol problem. Scotland drinks more than the rest of the UK, with the central belt the worst. Also Scots drink more spirits than anyone else.

Er, no.

Expressed as pure percentages of our population we have higher consumption (but lower than the Welsh). In real numbers though, the English have far more people abusing the stuff.

London had the lowest percentage of people who had drunk alcohol in the previous week (51%), followed by Wales (53%). The highest percentages were in the South East (62%) and the South West (62%). The percentage of people that had drunk their weekly limit in one day was highest for Wales (14%) and Scotland (13%). For each region in England, up to 1 in 10 people had drunk more than 14 units in one day.

See Fig.3 for pretty pictures.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/drugusealcoholandsmoking/bulletins/opinionsandlifestylesurveyadultdrinkinghabitsingreatbritain/2014#higher-percentage-of-drinkers-in-wales-and-scotland-drink-over-the-recommended-weekly-amount-in-one-day

Expressed as pure percentages of our population we have higher consumption (but lower than the Welsh). In real numbers though, the English have far more people abusing the stuff.

You think that has anything to do with the population figures? IE % is a good way of expressing it – 53 million vs 5.2 million

It took me a long time to understand why the SWA were fighting it, given the price of a bottle of Scotch would be unaffected. (only cheap nasty own brand stuff is close to falling under the limit, and I doubt the distillers are taking the margin hit).

An industry insider recently shed some light on it for me. All the pure ethanol that goes into making the cheap cider etc. Is distilled by SWA members. their objection has nothing to do with whisky and everything to do with profit. They also suggested that a precedent for England would be a bigger problem than the Scottish issue itself.

Plus 90% of scotch is exported outside UK

An industry insider recently shed some light on it for me. All the pure ethanol that goes into making the cheap cider etc. Is distilled by SWA members. their objection has nothing to do with whisky and everything to do with profit.

Or even just the ability to break even.

Some distilleries don’t make enough money on the good stuff to keep running. So they sell off a lot of byproduct or side lines and that keeps the lights on and stills running.

Take away the cheap stuff and the proper whisky may go with it.

My main objection to this has always been the implementation – it isn’t a tax, it will just boost supermarket profits.

An industry insider recently shed some light on it for me. All the pure ethanol that goes into making the cheap cider etc. Is distilled by SWA members. their objection has nothing to do with whisky and everything to do with profit.

Not just recent, Scottish distillers were trying to block some of the Baltic states requesting that Vodka be given a provenance lable for the same reason, Scottish distillers were responsible for the dirt cheap “vodka” distilled from unspecified materials.

it will just boost supermarket profits.

Supermarkets have been selling booze below cost precisely for purposes of profit. They might be forced to charge more for cheap booze but I doubt they’d necessarily benefit by doing so – they’d just have to chose another loss-leader.

Where is the English parliament on this now anyway?

The what?

The European Court press release sums things up well As grumpysculler said minimum unit price is not a tax.

Interesting stuff on the SWA. Ta.

I am in favour of minimum pricing

It has the same effect as a tax, other than not being a means of raising revenue for the government.

Given that the price elasticity of demand for alcohol is ineleastic, it seems a very odd measure to support and a suboptimal measure for dealing with the issue.

Still if you wont to transfer money from low income households to retailers and the largely foreign owned alcohol companies in Scotland, on youse goes….

audit scotland I am in favour of minimum unit pricing too. Audit Scotland said we spent 2.5 billion on dealing with the harm caused by alcohol and considered it’s own figures likely to be an underestimate.
If unit pricing reduces even a small per centage of that then scarce funds can be re allocated . All of this ignores the primary damage of wasted lives and the emotional and psychological strain on family and friends. It is a small step towards a rational policy on drugs of which alcohol is only one.

Pish, if you’re an alcoholic you’ll still drink regardless, either that or it’s back to the cheap hairspray and milk cocktails. Putting more money straight into supermarkets and such is just nonsense. I’ve often wondered about who is pushing this law and what they stand to gain from it.

Good headline (notice the trend) poor policy choice (ditto)

Great idea Scotroutes, but how will you get it over the Wall. 🙂

I don’t think minimum unit pricing is aimed at alcoholics squirrelking but perhaps at people who drink excessively to the extent that it is a problem for them and their families but who are not yet alcoholics. And no I don’t think giving money to supermarkets is a good thing either .