Personally I think you should just pay the original amount if it was a confirmed price in £’s
But I do wonder what would happen if you tell them you never received it, and as you weren’t charged just gave up waiting

But I do wonder what would happen if you tell them you never received it, and as you weren’t charged just gave up waiting

Is it worth a potential fraud conviction to find out?

I would send it back and get a new one.

A year later, you could be on the verge of bankruptcy, and this tips you over.

It’s unreasonable to expect the customer to suddenly pay. A year back the 2or4k might not have been noticed, but brexit has brought hard times for some.

Certainly seems unfair for the buyer rather than the company.

The crap with finances is a decent excuse – I check my bank account once every 6 months or less, if I’ve paid for something I expect that money to come out if my account there and then.

Larkim: Without wanting to sound nosey, but is that from a finance contract by any chance?

bearnecessities and larkim – If Canyon claim retention of title on pro-forma purchases haven’t they shot themselves in the foot with this purchase?

If they have retention of title then the OP could just offer them the bike back and they would have to accept it.

(1) We retain legal title to any product supplied by us until the purchase price (including VAT and shipping costs) for such product has been fully paid.”

That sounds like… new bike day to me. OP just says “Good point. I don’t have any money so please collect my one year old bike. While you’re at it bring me one of those new ones at the same time and I’ll pay for it there and then”.

frankconway – Member

As Canyon are German your contract with them is subject to German law.

Not necessarily, it could be subject to any law – depends on the contract.

You mentioned consumer law in your first post which is why I referred to it. You then referred to contract law. You seem confused.

It’s not debt though when you’ve given them the card details and they failed to charge it. That’s their problem.

Sorry, that’s bollocks, unless there’s a contractual term to that effect.

Canyon being canyon said in their email to me yesterday, that I needed to pay invoice within ten days using the bank details included. Guess what? No bank details included.
They are so incompetent

I’ve no idea whether OP is legally obliged to make a payment (in his shoes I’d offer to pay it at the same price in £ as it was at the time of sale, possibly in installments, and certainly not within 10 days if I didn’t have much cash currently) but those quoting terms of a contract should bear in mind that most contracts have totally unenforceable clauses in them – that’s where the law matters.

I’m not familiar enough with English, let alone German, consumer laws, nor which would strictly apply in this case. But just because it says something in a contract doesn’t mean you’re going to be bound to it.

Tell them you never received the bike and didn’t chase it because they didn’t take the money. Good luck.

good luck indeed. A conviction for fraud by false representation will do wonders for your future.

As per many other posts- contact them and pay the price agreed at the time of the order on terms you can manage.

This is just one of those out-there, crazy ideas, but, has the OP tried picking up the phone and talking to Canyon about it?

It sounds like it would be the best way to put across a message like, I thought I’d already paid for it, I don’t have the money to pay for it in full now but perhaps we can come to some arrangement, however I don’t think I should have to pay any more than the amount I’d originally agreed to pay a year ago.

@cynic-al: no, not confused; it’s a contract under consumer law and all sales by Canyon are subject to German law.

Don’t think he’s interested in that, he just wants to see if he can chance it further and get the free bike he always wanted 🙂

I’m still curious as to the legal position; based on nothing more than a layman’s knowledge of life-type-stuff, it feels like Canyon hold none of the cards.

Has anyone forwarded the thread to Canyon yet? 😈

There may be more to this than we are being told by the OP.
The following is from a thread that is over a year old:

nobbyq – Member
i wouldnt wait , ive been waiting for a bike (strive )since sept , delayed every week ,now end of jan so i cancelled today , whos to say it wont be delayed in march again ,but only you can know !

That opens up the possibility that he did actually cancel his order and Canyon sent it any way.

The forum will have probably corrupted into a pile of squiggles and ampersands by the time they read it anyhow.

Edit: Ooh, plot thickens 🙂

*waves at lurking OP*

I’m sure that by now Canyon will be aware of this thread, [edit: beaten to it! ]and will have a good idea of who the purchaser is. Any claims of ” I didn’t get it ” might not be believed.
A change of circumstance after a purchase is not a good reason to seek a cancellation of a debt. Even if you were not billed, there will be an assumption that you will have put those funds by in order to pay,.

Interesting conundrum. I don’t think it’s up to the OP to phone anyone.

It’s Canyon what’s cocked up and it is they who should have phoned, apologised and explained the situation before emailing or posting a confirmation including an invoice already suitably discounted to *at least* the point of sale sterling value.

So I would wait and see if this personalised contact materialises.

@bearnecessities: agree that OP is considering chancing this a bit further.
As for legal position it seems to me that Canyon hold all of the cards – the OP can test that at his risk.
For third time I suggest that OP calls Canyon to discuss and find mutually acceptable solution.
I’ve looked at Canyon’s conditions of sale and there doesn’t appear to be anything there which might contravene unfair contract terms legislation.
As I see it there are only a limited number of outcomes – discuss & agree resolution; discuss and Canyon write this off; do nothing and get away with it; do nothing and be sued.
Any other suggestions can be dismissed as non-starters.
Bored with this thread now.

He’s had a personalised contact. It’s an invoice for goods that he has received & used. Now it’s time to pay. I can’t see why the invoice should be queried at all, unless it’s to check whether the original agreement was for E or £.
Regard the sale as 12 months’ free credit, and arrange to pay like the honest person we’d like you to be.

No apology. They’ve cocked up and that should be their starting point if they want to recoup their loss.

That is my position. Apologise for your mistake, then we’ll talk.

As soon as I read the OP I thought it might be about Canyon. They did this to me a few years ago, not for a bike but for spares which I thought should have been warranty parts. They took such a long time to actually do anything, despite repeated emails, that the hold on my money/card expired. It’s interesting to see that nothing has changed.

I’m amazed that they are starting sales in the US this year since they’re clearly still such a mess. It’s a shame, if the support/customer service was there they could do very well.

That is my position. Apologise for your mistake, then we’ll talk.

Are you 12 years old?

No. Why, does politeness not apply to adults?

On a practical note it’s not difficult, check the contract.

Does it say the price is in Euro or GBP? If it’s the latter, write back to them and point out their mistake and ask them to resubmit the invoice in £. If the former, then you’ve got to pay the euro amount.

You might get some ex gratia discount because they acknowledge that they’ve messed up in taking payment. Because I think it’s unlikely there’s anything in the contract that says it’s their duty to take the payment, it’s your duty as the buyer to pay for things, not the other way around. So it’s a case of appealing to their goodwill (i.e. don’t be a dick about it).

No. Why, does politeness not apply to adults?

He was being generous, most people stop stealing toys long before 12.

Are you 2 public sector? I run my own business. If I had cocked up like Canyon have here, I would be apologising to my valued customer and looking to minimise the loss I face. Not just blankly firing an invoice over for more than the sterling amount from over a year ago.

I am.

#challengingstereotypes 🙂

It’s a rubbish way of doing business anyway. Why do they mess about with bank transfers and not take cards!?

valued customer

TBH, I’d not consider someone that until they were holding up their side of the contract.

It’s a rubbish way of doing business anyway. Why do they mess about with bank transfers and not take cards!?

It’s a German thing.

IMO they can’t reasonably expect you to pay the Euro price if the exchange rate has subsequently moved in their favour.

If your financial situation makes paying difficult now, perhaps they’d consider installments? Or just send it back?

the way i see it OP ha a number of options:
a) contact canyon and tell them that the person they are looking for no longer lives at that address
b) tell them he never received a bike from them and seeing as no money was taken he never chased it up with them (as previously mentioned)
c) contact canyon and tell them he will pay but cannot afford the full amount as the money he earmarked for the bike has been spent and he can only afford to pay it back in instalments
d) pay back the original agreed price in full
e) pay the invoiced amount in full
f) do nothing and see what happens next

either way canyon have cocked up…while there is a responsibility for the OP to have checked that the payment had been made after he got the bike…i can see how he wouldnt have checked.
i buy plenty of stuff online as do many other people…form places such as amazon and CRC…how many times do you check that the money has left your account. many people buy online under the assumption that once the payment details have been given and the item sent then the transaction has been completed.

if it was me i’d be asking for a discount on last years price due to their ineptitude and then insist on payment in instalments

i just bought a new bike at the weekend…paid for it on my card and then later that day checked my account to make sure the money had gone…which was a moot point really as i already had the bike by then…but if the money hadnt gone yet then i’d be contacting the retailer to tell them .

What did you buy in the end gonzy?

I can’t help finding the whole “trying to find a way to get out of paying for something I have the benefit of” a bit distasteful. There’s been an admin error at Canyon, that’s all. The admin error doesn’t remove your ethical (and I think legal) obligation to do the right thing and pay for the bike you have had, rather than try to wriggle out of it.

Drop them a line, attach original invoice, I’d suggest the following:

“Thanks for your invoice – I hadn’t noticed the payment hasn’t gone. I’ve reattached the original order confirmation at €XXXX. As this is clearly an innocent admin error on both our parts, I’d proposed splitting the original balance over 4 instalments of €XXXX, payable on the first of each month, starting XX/XX/XX”

Simple. Do the right thing.

Many of the small businessmen on this website will be used to this sort of thing, either buying / selling on 90 day’s credit (which some big companies insist upon from their suppliers) or retentions dependent upon snagging etc. So payment requests often go missing until the end of a financial year or afterwards.

Pay it, it’s the right thing to do.

What did you buy in the end gonzy?

reign advanced…see my other post for pics

see my other post for pics

ignore that Chakaping..here it is

That lamppost really sets off the orange nicely.

I think it comes with the bike.

That lamppost really sets off the orange nicely.

its actually red

the lampost was extra…i couldnt afford it 😀