the-muffin-man – Member
you could replace slasher with Luther, Breaking Bad, even Silent Witness etc., all things you wouldn’t watch in front of young children.

I don’t think it’s quite the same thing. Obviously I avoid playing overtly explicit music to my 5-year-old (but I have to say I don’t have much music that exhibits strongly misogynistic themes) – I wouldn’t play Wu Tang Clan stuff, for example (sorry, I think that’s about as contemporary rap as I get…) but on the other hand, if a tune has a few naughty words in, I don’t get too het up about it.

My son has heard naughty words (mainly from me in times of stress/pain – sorry) but is aware that daddy is naughty and shouldn’t say them, and neither should he. The odd f-bomb in a tune is different to actively making the decision to show graphic violence IMHO.

Children shouldn’t hear sweary music (with the approval of adults) in the same way the same adults shouldn’t swear in front of them.

So disapprove then, as they get older you’ll find yourself disapproving of a host of things they say and do and unable to do anything about it. Your disapproval will mean more if your kids have learned that if you strongly disapprove of something then it’s perhaps a higher risk or more anti-social activity than swearing.

I didn’t stop junior watching Liam mouthing off but disapproved, a measured response. Now a little older junior realises that Liam makes a complete fool of himself with his potty-mouthed bile.

It would be nice to take a time machine and have this conversation when you kids are 18 and you’ve dealt with a mountain of provocation, and swearing doesn’t even register as a point worth discussing with them. If by 18 they aren’t dead, injured, in jail, druggies, chain smokers, binge drinkers, parents, HIV positive, anarchists living in a tent or fighting a foreign war… then you’ve done well and been lucky.

I had enough difficulty explaining the morality of fairy tales to my kids, like this lovely one she got home from school the other day:

Mmmm… witchcraft, curses, martyrdom, infanticide, and nice full colour image of the heroine being burnt at the stake. Ideal bedtime reading for a 5 year old. 😯

So we’re back to “blame the teachers”. 🙁

Junior has always watched the news with us. He’s therefore seen worse and knows it’s for real. Fairytales are just that and fall into the category of father Christmas, fantasy. The important thing to teach is that some things that are OK in fantasy world are really not OK in the real world.

So we’re back to “blame the teachers”.

The school gave her a reading book which led to a bedtime discussion about what “being burnt alive” means and her being scared that she might be burnt alive for some imagined crime.

I’m not usually a “blame the teachers” kinda guy, but in this instance I don’t think it was the best choice of book.

Junior has always watched the news with us. He’s therefore seen worse and knows it’s for real.

Good plan – I’ll show her those videos of people screaming as ISIS burn them alive, so she knows what it looks like outside of fantasy.

That will definitely ensure she grows up mentally stable.

So disapprove then, as they get older you’ll find yourself disapproving of a host of things they say and do and unable to do anything about it.

Not at all unable – teaching a child by example is, in itself, enabling…

I grew up with the Vietnam war, Belfast, student riots, tanks in the streets on TV. My parents were bombed and played in aircraft wreckage for real.

Kids cope with things in a matter of fact way. I really don’t think that junior listening to Liam mouthing off will lead to mental health issues. “Protecting him” from the world as it really is might have though, because you can’t protect them for ever and progressively learning is preferable to a culture shock.

I don’t have much to add to this thread as my son is only 10 months old, but I have it all to come so am reading with interest.

I would however like to congratulate edukator. Two pages in, and he’s so far resisted the temptation to tell everyone that he lives in France 🙂

Well done. Keep it up.

So when I sit down to let her watch the news with me how do you suggest I let her “progressively learn” what the phrase “brutally raped and murdered” means? Or “child pornography”? Or “suicide bombing”?

I’m not saying they should be shielded from reality till they are 18, but personally I’d rather introduce normal notions of sex, death and behaviour, before covering the abnormal ones.

And that includes not teaching young children to swear and not swearing in front of them.

One of juniors mates recently ran out of the house barefoot and was found dead of exposure a couple of days later. Unless you maintain your sprinting levels at what a super-fit 18 year old can do you are “unable”.

Set a good example by all means, I reckon that getting all upset about a few swear words in songs is far from setting a good example. I remember my parents laughing at Chuck Berry’s “My Ding-a-ling”, explaining what his ding-a-ling really was and finding the Mary Whitehouse ban attempt pathetic. I also remember my father’s favourite names for his car when it broke. I think they set an excellent example.

And what are the beeped words in Boy named Sue?

So when I sit down to let her watch the news with me how do you suggest I let her “progressively learn” what the phrase “brutally raped and murdered” means? Or “child pornography”? Or “suicide bombing”?

Exactly this. We left our two girls watching the telly and the news came on. A few minutes later one of them came through asking us to explain what ‘raped and left for dead’ meant.

Ohh and Edukator – I don’t get ‘all upset’ by swearing in music (I listen to Dr Dre, Eminem etc). It doesn’t mean I would play their stuff in front of my girls.

(I have no idea what point you are making about running after children – it makes no sense whatsoever so I won’t attempt to comment on that)

A gratuitous and unrelated dig from Neal, I’m flattered. NTM

And what are the beeped words in Boy named Sue?

**** and bugger

Strangely the first word which is what most parents do regularly gets censored but the second which would get most husbands a slap or divorce is not.

what most parents do regularly

Things are very different in France aren’t they? 😆

TBH if you go down the censoring swearing route, what are you going to do about explaining the lyrics in Lucy in Sky with Diamonds or Brown Sugar or Golden Brown, or Perfect day, or I’m waiting for the man…None of which have any swearing in.

swearing in context…they’re **** ace… 😆

JohnDoh has never been to Fife. It is NORMAL there. They make your roughest sweary Builder look like a saint!

Nickc – that’s easy. I’d say I don’t really know as that is a pretty honest answer really.

Kids need parents who show balanced, measured and tolerant attitudes. Parents who react proportionately.

I would certainly agree with that.

A gratuitous and unrelated dig from Neal, I’m flattered. NTM

It was a lighthearted poke in the ribs (see the smiley?)

Hardly “reacting proportionally” are you ?

Care to explain the super clever French acronym you used at the end ?

Has anyone come across anything that can automatically bleep the swear words out of songs played through Spotify etc.

Is there an app or something that adds extra swear words into songs that don’t have them? Like musical Tourettes kinda thing? I’d buy that. 😉

Care to explain the super clever French acronym you used at the end ?

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfvCQx8ozFY[/video]

?

NSF[french speaking]W

nickc – Member

TBH if you go down the censoring swearing route, what are you going to do about explaining the lyrics in Lucy in Sky with Diamonds or Brown Sugar or Golden Brown, or Perfect day, or I’m waiting for the man…None of which have any swearing in.

Kids will often sing songs though without knowing what the meaning is and you don’t ‘have’ to explain them.
I didn’t realise what the song ‘Golden Brown’ was actually about until I was about 18. Never questioned the lyrics – just thought it was a good song.
One of my nephews is the same with Ed Sheeran’s song, A-Team. He’s just turned 8, sings it all the time but has no idea what it’s about and has never asked.
But, I’m pretty sure my Sister wouldn’t be happy with him listening to & singing the lyrics to Metallica’s So What, though.

gfs, I know what it means 🙂

I was wondering how edukator would justify. “F*^* your mother!” As a proportionate reaction.

I quite like it

EDIT – the Album I mean

Edukator – you completely and utterly miss my point. I do not doubt for a minute that children learn all these words as they progress through school and via the internet but our responsibility as adults dictate that we do not openly accept it as normal. Children shouldn’t hear sweary music (with the approval of adults) in the same way the same adults shouldn’t swear in front of them.

I agree with Johndo here. My son is 13 and I know he watches youtube videos with swearing in them, films with swearing in them (eg, Kick Ass – which his mother let him watch last year!) and he has started to like grime music, which is full of it! However I don’t encourage him to listen to sweary things and would rather he had ‘clean’ versions of songs! In fact i think he’s a bit embarrassed by swears in songs when I’m around, which is strange cos he knows what I listen to! – he played me a track in the car the other day and skipped the end where there was a talking bit full of Fs.

I can only suggest that anyone worried about the kiddies hearing inappropriate lyrics set up censored playlists that don’t have iffy stuff included.
Which may not work with things like Spotify, in which case stop using Spotify and use your own music instead of rented music.
I have a CD single of a track from a movie soundtrack, Another Body Murdered, by Faith No More V The Booya Tribe, and it has various words obscured, like they do on the Beeb, and it bugs the heck out of me; I can’t seem to find an unexpurgated version. 👿

I once complained to the BBC when they showed Rage Against the Machine live and bleeped (very badly) all the swears out.
They showed it again on a Best of Late Show music with the rude words back in.
I like to think I did that. **** the BBC!

ps – CountZero – you need the album version http://r.ebay.com/ZwjAOy 😆

I have a CD single of a track from a movie soundtrack, Another Body Murdered, by Faith No More V The Booya Tribe,

Ah that’ll be the “Judgement Night” album – I used to love that – cracking soundtrack to a fairly mediocre movie.