Also you need to think, can you really see Edd ‘William Pitt the Younger’ Milliband as PM? Merkel would eat him for breakfast and we’d be a laughing stock.

If you know British history from something other than Blackadder, Pitt the Younger was a pretty good PM (and a Tory): reduced national debt, reduced corruption, outmanouvered France and Spain, reduced the constraints on Irish Catholics to bind them to the Union, reduced use of press gangs, was modest in personal affairs…

If that is the way GO looks after his so-called friends then who needs enemies. Look which segment of the population has seen the biggest hit to income, then think about the bank levy – continued to the extent that we have two major banks discussing relocation.

having missed the opportunity for proportional representation AND the chance to offload Scotland…
I still broadly back the tories for the next term in government.

locally however, safest seat imaginable, i personally wont vote for them, bunch of greedy self serving *****, the torys wont do anything for me as i aint got a pot to piss in.

my politics lies somewhere between libdem (2nd) and green (nowhere), both of which have policies i agree with, but neither the complete package.

I wont vote labour, despite my grandparents turning in their graves – maybe in the future the labour party will re-emerge, but till then. out.

the most important thing i can really do is bolster the non-ukip vote for the area.

At least Tory boy has had a series of actual, useful jobs. Never been in politics before, ties to the local economy in more ways than one (he’s farming stock, studied agriculture and forestry, served in the forces) and generally is a visible, well-liked individual…

Rather!

It’s weird that you say “actual, useful” jobs because usually what people who are saying that are trying to do is sneer at social workers and legal aid lawyers and the like. But the examples of jobs you gave were being a hereditary farmer and military person – in other words, a government job and a job heavily subsidised by the government. That’s not very capitalist!

Who exactly are we talking about?

There is no way I would vote Tory here. Our Con MP is a total joke, he likes cutting ribbons and grinning in his tweeds. Yesterday his pitiful flyer came through the door with a picture compilation of his local achievements last term. The best he came up with in 5 years was sending some guy to the Euro Tri Champs, who came 15th.

Our Labour candidate was MP previously and tirelessly worked for the constituency in a very positive, sensible way. Safeguarding essential services, working with business etc. He was also one of the first to speak out against Blair and the War.

anyone on here voting tory. why?

Why do you want to know? Have you found out what you wanted to?

Yes, FWIW.

1: Tactically, against a strong UKCRAP presence in the Mole Valley.
2: It’s the economy,stupid.

I should have been a bit more clear – these are not my views but how he is generally perceived.

flip flopping at its finest, the edinburgh defence as it was renamed

Mods at it again I see…

Odd that you can’t discuss issues of import to everyone on the planet without censorship

Je Suis Charlie n whatnot…

Try again, worst they can do is ban me, (again)

Be interesting to see just how long term the tory economic plan is:

After all, National debt is over £1.5 Trillion and continuing to increase

An inevitable outcome of the current economic system:

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWl7Mb49vSk[/video]

Or put more simply:

Bankers: Sorry, we’ve lost all your money
Us: What are you going to do about it?
Bankers: Nothing, you’ll have to give us more money
Us: Where are we supposed to get that from?
Bankers: You’ll have to borrow it
Us: Who the f*ck is going to lend us that sort of money?
Bankers: We will
Us: But you said you lost all the money
Bankers: We did, but you’re gonna give some more, so we’ll lend you that

(True Story)

On top of that, we have the swift decline of the environment, in no small part due to the arms industry:

Environmental impact of modern war

The wars that profit the arms industry also happen to make some people very upset and create further wars and terrorism…

The same arms industry benefits the bankers, many of those who own the media and quite a few of the politicians themselves.

Of course, it sucks having to worry about these things and we could just pretend it doesn’t happen, as that’s a lot easier than facing up to problems, but if we don’t do something about it, it might be a bit late for our kids and grandkids.

Will your vote change that?

Not if you vote for any of the traditional parties and the same old bullsh*t

Discussion would be fine, jhj. It’s just that you don’t discuss, you just blurt rubbish all over the screen and then turn a deaf ear to anyone who points out your obvious nonsense in preparation for more blurts.

No one has discussed the points raised (then deleted by mods) Woppit, so turning a deaf ear is the only option…

JHJ, given that you earlier post seemed in conflict with

Legally anything you write on our forum is deemed to have been ‘published’ by Gofar Enterprises Ltd. That’s why we sometimes have to remove posts that could cause us potential legal problems.

I would suggest that the mods were being very sensible.

Seems to me that a tory vote is a frank and honest admission that you have no concern for people who for whatever reason find themselves dependent on the govt in some way. For those of us with jobs/careers/houses/cars/fancy mountain bikes it doesn’t make much difference, we can stand on our own two feet. For those who are on benefits, rely on state help to care for relatives or themselves, those who have slipped through the net of the jobs market, kids who don’t have well-off parents to fund them through higher education, the homeless, those in need of medical help, basically anyone who needs a govt provided service to help them with the basic necessities of life, then a tory govt will be a disaster. And for those of you voting for this, at least you’re being honest about not giving a sh*t about it. Hopefully you won’t find yourself in a similar situation one day.

@jj the national debt is continuing to rise as bringing the Labour created deficit under control has been very difficult not least as we had a recession, that’s the whole point of remarks like “fixing the roof when the sun is shining”. Under Labour the deficit grew from 50bn to 100bn during the good years when it should have been falling. Remember Blair inherited a budget surplus from John major.

Discussion would be fine, jhj. It’s just that you don’t discuss, you just blurt rubbish all over the screen and then turn a deaf ear to anyone who points out your obvious nonsense in preparation for more blurts.

The irony oh the irony 🙄

Seems to me that a tory vote is a frank and honest admission that you have no concern for people who for whatever reason find themselves dependent on the govt in some way

@daz I see things totally differently, without a strong economy you cannot have a welfare state at all, that’s the grave danger of financial mismanagement. See my post on the other thread, the Tories have spent half a trillion (£550bn) on welfare during their 5 years in coalition government. That’s hardly “no concern” is it ?

Seems to me that a tory vote is a frank and honest admission that you have no concern for people who for whatever reason find themselves dependent on the govt in some way. For those of us with jobs/careers/houses/cars/fancy mountain bikes it doesn’t make much difference, we can stand on our own two feet. For those who are on benefits, rely on state help to care for relatives or themselves, those who have slipped through the net of the jobs market, kids who don’t have well-off parents to fund them through higher education, the homeless, those in need of medical help, basically anyone who needs a govt provided service to help them with the basic necessities of life, then a tory govt will be a disaster. And for those of you voting for this, at least you’re being honest about not giving a sh*t about it. Hopefully you won’t find yourself in a similar situation one day.

So is your view that cases like the one below, albeit an outlier do not merit any reform of welfare or tightening of the rules? Even if it takes thousands of families paying tax to fund each case like this?

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/556012/Titina-Nzolameso-migrant-mum-court-fight-new-London-home?utm_source=Outbrain&utm_medium=externalwidget&utm_term=expressshowbiz&utm_campaign=outbrainfebruary

Looking after their friends ?

The Tories massively increased stamp duty and closed the glaring loophole Labour left re offshore owenership. They increased VAT, the rich pay much more VAT. The decrease in top rate tax from 50+2 to 47+2 IMO actually lead to more tax being collected. They increased the tax take from non-doms.

Seems to me that a tory vote is a frank and honest admission that you have no concern for people who for whatever reason find themselves dependent on the govt in some way.

Clearly not true, as some people will feel that the best way to help people is too grow the economy, provide more jobs, and hence, increase the total tax take. Where as destroying the economy is no way to help anyone.

My earlier post has not been deleted…

I’d be only too happy to see David Cameron in court on the matter~ for some reason, he seems a bit reticent to raise any legal action concerning his prior knowledge of organized Child Abuse involving the intelligence services, the Arms Industry and South Africa.

Regardless, this isn’t just about the Conservative Party, as Tony Blair has amply proved, the Labour Party aren’t much better.

GCHQ/NSA didn’t just appear overnight and Con-Lib-Lab are all complicit in hiding it from the public, just as they are with abuse of vulnerable children by very powerful people, over several decades…

If that and bailing the banks out sit right with you, then by all means vote for whichever of those parties has best pandered to your insecurities…

So is your view that cases like the one below, albeit an outlier do not merit any reform of welfare or tightening of the rules?

Exactly, it’s an outlier. The welfare state will never be perfect, there will always be anomalies at the edges where some people benefit disproportionately, but past and recent history has shown that reforms to tackle these have resulted in far more people who really need help suffering through no fault of their own. I’d support any reforms to tackle anomalies as long as it ensured that it didn’t impact others. The reality though is that the tories have an agenda to reduce the welfare state irrespective of the impact on those who need it, and these anomalous cases are used to support this agenda.

I’ll be doing what you’re meant to be doing at elections, and voting on local issues.

In a traditional Tory stronghold it’s ironic that UKIP and Green are neck and neck at the moment.

For that reason alone, I’ll be voting Green.

the most important thing i can really do is bolster the non-ukip vote for the area.

snap.
Rochester and Strood is my home constituency. All the other parties are nowhere in what is usually a Con-Lab marginal, but now likely to be a Con-Kipper marginal.

I’ll be voting Tory for the simple reason that any new government initially takes a considerable amount of time working out how to effect even the most simple of changes. Instability is not what the country / economy needs at the moment.

Sorry, I’m a bit late to this, but don’t forget that Labour also killed off the Queen Mum (god bless her).

I’ll be doing what you’re meant to be doing at elections, and voting on local issues.

Very noble of you Binners, unfortunately posted in the wrong thread as the tories here will be voting with their pockets, and **** everyone and everything else.

How do the rich pay more VAT???

It is a regressive tax come on Jambalya you can do better than that.

Everyone supporting the coalition has read this sweary angry yet accurate report on their time in office, right?

The Tories massively increased stamp duty and closed the glaring loophole Labour left re offshore owenership. They increased VAT, the rich pay much more VAT. The decrease in top rate tax from 50+2 to 47+2 IMO actually lead to more tax being collected. They increased the tax take from non-doms.

Scrub that you should present on Fox news …they love this sort of impartial fact based analysis of current affairs

The poorest 20% of UK households spend a higher proportion of their disposable income on VAT than the richest 20%, the Office for National Statistics said…..This latest piece of research reinforces what is widely perceived to be the fundamental inequality at the heart of VAT: the poorer pay more of it relative to their incomes than the wealthy,” said David Breger of HW Fisher & Company chartered accountants.
“It’s clear that the Government needs to reconsider the full effect of VAT, which is inherently regressive.”

For clarity this was BEFORE the Tory increase in VAT they promised not to do

As I said Fox news would love your ability to “deliver the facts 100 % accurately whilst never being proved wrong

oh and afterwards

Official figures show that the least well off households have been coughing up 36.6% of their income to the Treasury.

But the wealthiest have been paying less – 35.5%.

The Office for National Statistics, which released the report, partly blamed the tax scandal on millionaire Mr Osborne’s controversial decision to raise VAT to 20% in January 2011….the ONS report confirmed it yesterday when it said indirect taxes like VAT “increase inequality”. .

The rich do pay more as they have more to spend unfortunately the poor pay a greater % and have a greater burden of the VAT budget

Our Tory candidate is a local lad who is now a Westminster Councillor while working for a PR firm whose main clients are getting private firms into the NHS. He previously worked for a right-wing think tank, did an internship with a Tea Party Republican and a year with Oliver Letwin. Even at 16, his nickname was Tory Boy. He even sounds like George Osborne, which is an achievement for someone born and raised in Darlington. He’s also given some spectacularly stupid answers to questions at hustings, and is largely abandoned by (what’s left of) the local party.

In 2020 he’ll be parachuted into a safe Tory seat somewhere, so some of you may get to meet him.

Clearly not true, as some people will feel that the best way to help people is too grow the economy, provide more jobs, and hence, increase the total tax take. Where as destroying the economy is no way to help anyone.

It’s nothing to do with the economy. The differences between labour and tory are so small on economic policy that it will have no measurable effect. The main difference between them is one of a willingness to support those at the bottom who need support to stand on their own two feet. The tories would gladly cast them all aside if they thought it wouldn’t result in mass civil unrest and a completely divided society at war with itself (the US, South Africa etc are good examples). Labour, for all their faults, at least make an effort to redress the balance, albeit rather inefficiently.

They increased VAT, the rich pay much more VAT.

I missed that first time round. Brilliant.

They increased VAT, the rich pay much more VAT.

Because they buy more stuff. Of course, poor people pay more tax as a percentage of their income for such non-essentials as clothes and fuel.

robowns – Member

Yes – I work for a bank in central London, enough said really.
Indeed it does – self interested parasite more interested in the contents of your own pocket than the welfare of others. Tory it’ll be then.

It is interesting that people post on here about how nasty the Tory party is. Yet, if you look through this thread and the countless others the real nastiness seems to come from those against the Tory party.

I did a postal vote and didn’t vote Tory.

the real nastiness seems to come from those against the Tory party

Science innit?

For every action, there’s an equal and opposite reaction. The Tory’s have been responsible for doing some really, really, nasty, malicious and vindictive stuff to a lot of people. Thats why they provoke such passionate, venomous hatred in large parts of the population. Because they thoroughly deserve it. You reap what you sow, and all that….

the real nastiness seems to come from those against the Tory party

IMHO the real nastiness is taxing the poor more, using bedroom taxes and sanctions whilst going after the disabled
Much worse than a lack of respect as shown on here

the real nastiness seems to come from those against the Tory party

I guess it comes from the despairing weariness and realisation of just how self-centred and narrow-minded an awful lot of people can be. What rankles the most is that most of them try to justify it through spurious logic of tough-love and ‘unfairness’ against ‘hard working people’ rather than just admitting that they don’t give a sh*t.

No. They have destroyed British Policing, ruined my pension and are making me work longer to get it! That is reason enough alone for me not to and I used to vote Tory.

Not got time to read the whole thread but this

they seem to be doing an okay job with getting the economy back on track and at least are talking some sense on the economy, i.e. live within our means, not borrowing recklessly

is quite revealing. You could just have easily said ‘the economy is recovering in spite of the Tory government, even though they’ve been under-investing.

To know the difference requires a lot of in-depth knowledge on the economy, I think. Do you have it? Or are you just responding to spin with typical human confirmation bias?

I suspect that 99% or more of the electorate are doing the latter. Probably me included. At least I’m looking for answers though rather than accepting the ones given to me.

IMHO the real nastiness is taxing the poor more, using bedroom taxes and sanctions whilst going after the disabled

This. The tories would make me better off financially, but I could never ever vote for a party that is so plainly vindictive.