If so what do you think of it?

(Sorry to be a bit vague but I'm trying to whittle down my options)

i think my focus is bobbins. Crap turbo lag (especially in second), faulty 12V plug, random wiper swishes, windows don't touch the seal so you can never open/close them to get rid of condensation, boring car full stop.

VW every time. Have a look Skoda octavia, especially the 4×4 estate. Same car just cheaper

Well, we did the rounds and had a look at most of those early last year,
My opinions are –
Golf – Nice but silly expensive and a bit under equipped, and if you look into it not as reliable as people will have you believe either….
Seat – Very nice. If I could have had a new or nearly new one, I'd have been very tempted. Still not cheap though, and we really wanted an estate…
Fiat – I like them a lot personally but none in our price rage at the time and the others feel a tad better built inside. Good value.
Focus – Well, we bought a Focus estate in the end because it fitted the bill and was a very good price. It handles superbly (Our is a petrol and it's noticeably more nimble and responsive than my sisters otherwise nearly identical diesel). It's very well built and decenlty equipped

One tip – Once you've decided on what you want, take your time and look EVERYWHERE for one! Prices vary wildly, too, from place to place and dealer to dealer. Ours was just 3 years old when we got it, with 16k on the clock, and it was virtually a new car. We paid £5995 a year ago. (55 reg car)
At the weekend we saw an identical car – Same age and spec (But with a diesel engine) which is now a year older, with 50k on the clock for £6995, which is now waaaaay overpriced….

Do some research! 🙂

Focus estate – goes, stops, goes round corners, relatively economical, reasonably cheap to maintain, only did 38,000 miles for the first set of tires though.

Not impressed with my g/f newer (desiel) focus, turbo lag is rubbish (and I'm a old shape focus owner).
Personnaly if I can afford it, it'll be a Golf next time, worth the extra IMO (had lots of hire cars).
Other surprising option I've had as a hire car is the Astra, over the last 4 years they've steadly improved to a really nice car.

Looked at all of those (and drove most) last year when looking.

Bravo is very good, both the diesels and the t-jet petrols. Lots of kit for the money including the great blue&me system for handsfree, playing MP3s off usb stick, etc. They depreciate hard so there are lots of good deals about, and a fair bit of nearly-new stock in dealers.

Leon is the worst of the cars using that platform, poor ride, cramped boot, rubbish interior. If you want a cheaper golf-platform car, buy an Octavia.

Golf is… a Golf. So if you want a fairly modern diesel engine (rather than the ancient 1.9PD) and a reasonable amount of kit, you're paying a fortune for a car that's otherwise nothing special.

Focus is OK although I don't see why the motoring press talk it up as being excellent to drive next to it's competition – I thought it was competent but average. If you want a diesel, avoid the old 1.8s and go for the much more modern 1.6 or 2.0 (joint venture with PSA and used in lots of french cars too).

In the end I settled on the Honda Civic. Found a top-spec EX (navigation, HID lights, bluetooth, auto lights/wipers, dual-zone climate, etc) ex-dealer demo at a great price, liked how it drives (especially the quick steering rack – about 2 turns lock to lock), liked how it looks, liked the engine (probably the best diesel in the class), liked the practicality. The boot is enormous, the seats fold perfectly flat in one movement (no flipping up the bases) but also flip up cinema-style for carrying tall or other bulky stuff. My other hobby is scuba diving and we can get 3 people, 6 x 15l tanks and all the other boxes/bags of kit in, nothing above the window line, no problem at all. More practical than most estates in the class – genius bit of packaging with the fuel tank under the front seats. Been very happy with it – over 20k miles on it under my ownership and zero problems, it's been great.

Peter > prices everywhere are up. I couldn't buy a replacement for my civic (same model/plate/miles) for less than £500 more than I paid 9 months ago.

New Mazda 3 as in the very new one just out? We have the previous model which stopped production last year if you want feedback on that one….

Focus estate – goes, stops, goes round corners, relatively economical, reasonably cheap to maintain, only did 38,000 miles for the first set of tires though.

What tyres were those, if you don't mind me asking? At 16k ours had already had new fronts before we got it, and the OE rear Contis have just been replaced at 25k.
Uesd to get 20k a set on the diesel Vectra we had before (Michelins, 90% motorway cruising)

Not impressed with my g/f newer (desiel) focus, turbo lag is rubbish

I'm finding this a bit odd. I've driven pretty much most cars and engines you can think of at some point and my sisters TDCi Focus has a lovely smooth spread of power, just as a diesel should be in my book. The mother-in-laws 140bhp VW diesel (Eos) is a totally different kettle of fish though. Flat as a pancake until the turbo decides to wake up, then a 2-stroke-like powerband. Lots of umph, yeah, but not well delivered at all. I seem to remember playing around putting my foot down and counting the turbo in…. IIRC it was about 4 seconds before anything of note happened doing this from 13-1500 rpm…..

Peter > prices everywhere are up. I couldn't buy a replacement for my civic (same model/plate/miles) for less than £500 more than I paid 9 months ago.

Ahh I see. Is that a fact? Nice to know though. 🙂
There was a lot of varience whe we bought ours as well though IIRC.

err… Michelin somethings……… sorry, as long as it goes and stops, and goes round corners I don't really care.
I took it in to the dealer for the wiring loom recall in November and asked them to change all the tires and they were amazed that it'd done so many miles on them. Now changed to Pirelli somethings….
Ours is the 1.8tdci and it seems to go ok, I tend not to put my foot to the floor very often, but from about 1750rpm it seems to change speed appropriately.

they were amazed that it'd done so many miles on them.

To be fair, so am I! That's bloody good im my book, especially for a tourquey old diesel lump! I doubt the Pirellis will last that long.

Happily, I've just put 2 Michelins on ours. Happy days! 🙂

Not a focus but a C-Max. Agree about the turbo lag on the focuses but at the same time, lesser afflicted diesels that I've driven have been more gutless. Given how pokey the 2.0TDCi is in this size car, yet still returns 45 mpg around Bristol, 50mpg on long hauls – I love it!

Only MPV-type thing I've driven that felt like driving a car, and a good one at that – the handling belies the hulk of the thing. (Aside from the Seat Altea but it's just a chubby car and doesn't swallow enough gear)

My only complaint is running costs – when shit goes wrong it's expensive (but this is my first 'modern' car so probably not specific to this car), had two minor things go wrong (car didn't actually break down) but cost was crazy to fix – thankfully both warrantied.

Build quality of C-Max is not that of the normal focus – drivers door has uneven panel gaps (don't worry, car history was sound) and although it seems to be quiet now the weather is cold, the interior is a bit rattly and squeaky for my liking in warmer weather.

Although I had two things go wrong – neither were functionally preventative and I went a month before fixing them at my leisure – it has been reliable. I was worried it wasn't going to start this morning but after a 5 sec turnover it fired right up.

Would I buy again – probably – but if I wasn't forced to buy quickly (head gasket went on old car and we had a week to get something) I'd prob hold out for a Focus Estate.

Build quality of C-Max is not that of the normal focus

You know, I thought that too. We had a look at a couple of C/S-Maxes and they did seem a bit plasicky inside. Our Foucus estate is very well built IMO. No worse than the Eos I mentioned before in most areas, and signifcantly better in a couple.

my parents have an old shape focus 1.8 giah (sp?) estate

handles well (does half its miles on b-roads so it has to), goes, stops, very comfortable etc etc

Only expense other than tires has been a couple of coolant hoses on the engine and a headlamp bulb. Done 60,000miles.

Its just developed a knocking at full steering lock so no doubt the next service could turn out expensive, but as I said above, most of those miles are spent on b-roads so the steering has probably had a harder than average life.

Housemate has the 1.8diesle 100,000miles , no problems, but he's not one for mechanics so it could be a bag of bolts and he'd never notice untill he took it for a service.

Its just developed a knocking at full steering lock

That'll be bushes needing replacing probably – quite a small job and cheap replacement parts.

I've got the Fiat Bravo T-Jet Sport (the 150bhp turbo 1.4 petrol) – I really like it but it has a recurring gearbox problem.

It's only done 23k but is very comfy to drive…as much as it's only a 1.4 it does have a bit of poke to it, but don't expect it to take on the Civic Type-Rs…but it will keep up with most things and rip past a few others out there (if required).

Fuel economy seems to be a bit up and down, but could be due to the cold weather and hgaving to run it due to gearbox issue – the gear selection cables seem to keep freezing due to water ingress – happened twice now – gearbox goes solid and I need to get them replaced under warranty. From what I can tell though, this isn't a common issue but it does mean the car ha to sit idling for almost 1 hour until the gearbox can move again and I can then drive it. Today it was -5C and I had to wait 20 minutes, not such a problem as I also had to let the windscreen thaw out – but figured as I had to wait for the gearbox to free up I wouldn't scrape it. Hopefully service department will know tomorrow when the part is arriving from Milan. Oh and the headlights aren't that great until you get the fancy-pants types…they work but they aren't brilliant – upgrading the bulbs does help though.

Insurance is pretty good for it as well.

Some pics of the car – including with roof bars and bike racks.

I was thinking of changing it around April time, but I really like it, like the look and no real issues with the drive or anything. I'm getting about 34mpg out of it but I think the tyres were down a few psi and I'm only doing short journeys so not really maximising it, I think if my mileage increased even by 2k a year the fuel economy would go up a bit as it would run longer (I'd use more fuel to cover the 2k extra miles but the mpg would improve).

Turbo doesn't really have any lag and it has a Sport button that adjusts the torque something and gives a bit more oomph – bhp doesn't change but torque does – do notice a difference but I hardly use it. If you want instant kick it helps if you change down, but the engine seems very flexible.

It was an ex-demo and has the 18" alloys on it – tyres cost a small fortune but they last very well.

I can get 3 bikes in the back plus kit (all wheels off) – but there is very little space for anything else once fully packed – 2 passengers and the USB port allows umpteen music tracks and whatnot. The Blue&Me idea is very good…handsfree everything with the phone (apart from sending a text but it will read them out to you) – depends on phone model but Sony Ericsson's all work very well with it.

I really like the car, as much as I'm really wanting a Berlingo, I think it would be a waste of money, if I do change the car, it's going to be for something smaller as due to the mileage and kind of driving it gets used for, there is no real need for such a large car as our second vehicle.

Saying that, I'd have another Bravo without hesitation…

Pretty happy with our 06 Focus – Had no problems other than with the AC but fixing that was more of an issue with the numpties at the garage being unable to find where it was leaking. Fixed at the 6th attempt…

Oh and a power steering hose did pop off just before the end of the warranty but fixed fine.

Drives well, comfortable, feels solid, economy is reasonable (1.6LX) and it's got enough room for two adults and our 18month old plus all the pram/buggy/etc.

I'd buy another one happily enough.

Phew, glad I ordered my new Golf last month as VW have slapped a 3% increase across the range and for every accessories from January 1st. (Not to mention the 2.5% VAT increase.)

Have you condidered a Hyundai i30? I found the seats uncomfortable on my test drive so didn't buy but couldn't deny that you get lots of bang for your buck and a 5 year warranty.

Have you condidered a Hyundai i30? I found the seats uncomfortable on my test drive so didn't buy but couldn't deny that you get lots of bang for your buck and a 5 year warranty.

And be worth nothing as a trade in/private sale.

Very happy with my 07 Focus (petrol version though, so can't comment on turbo lag).
Comfy, reliable (so far), A-to-B with minimal fuss, plus loads of nice gadgets on mine.

Although I like them I think the Ford and VW might now be out of the running as I don't really want to pay a premium to drive the same car as everyone else (although there's probably a reason why there are so many of them).

Has anyone else had any experience with the Fiat Bravo? (I had a Fiat Punto about 9 years ago and loved it).

If you loved your Punto (I had one of those too) then you'll probably think any car is good 😉

clubber – It was my first car and I didn't know better!

We've curently got a Mazda 6, but want something a bit cheeper to run and hopefully more fun.

were in the same boat as you.

were probably going with a 09 reg Focus Zetec s 1.6

mainly because ford gave us a great part ex on the old fiesta.

The focus has the most kit for the money.

BUT……

as someone above mentions the Honda Civic is a very close second 😉

and the Mazda 3……

its a pain in the arse choosing a new car..

we have a baby due aswell.

One more for the Bravo. I've got a 2008 T-Jet 150 Sport and it's rather good. I've just had the gear cables replaced due to water ingress. Tyre wear may be a bit of an issue for some but I mainly use it on B-roads (esp. the B818 Denny to Fintry Road), with little motorway use, so the front wheels are rarely straight ahead.
It's got the 17" wheels. Luckily it's a Motability car so they cough up for the tyres!

I don't really want to pay a premium to drive the same car as everyone else

Look at it this way though: popularity means it's a well-supported car that will continue to have easily obtainable parts, experienced mechanics, known faults etc well into the future.

Luckily it's a Motability car so they cough up for the tyres!

Well that's certainly looking on the bright side… 😀

Not one on your list – but close to it although at the more expensive end. Audi A3 Sportback.

Build quality and finish is just about the best you can get in the low end premium market. Its a joy to drive although mine is the 2.0T FSI Quattro version. The front wheel drive only ones are less so. Faultless (so far!) – 4 years. I like the size – obviously not an estate but a lot more space than the equivalent 3 door (v. poor) and more than my previous golf. Seems relatively cheap to service – although perhaps that is just a trend with newer cars and variable service intervals – but so far has cost considerably less than my old Golf and previous Civic and far less than my expectations. No doubt Audi will manage to live up to its reputation in this regard at some point in the future! I would admit it is not really a looker

I've just seen that there's a new Alfa Romeo 147 replacement (Giulietta) comming in the summer so might have to wait and see what it's like (I can try and save up while I wait!) 😀

Had a last shape (05 reg) VW Golf TDI 1.9 PD, was a great car OVERALL but not without some mechanical gremlins in the first year (but then I was driving 30k+ miles a year so doing three years of average mileage a year).

My wife has an A3 2.0 TDI (same engine as you may be thinking of in Golf/Octavia) which is rapid BUT the lag before delivery of full power/ torque is about the worst of any car I've ever driven. I'm not sure if its turbo lag or a management issue to stop it stripping first and second gears but you pull away, floor it, count to 3 or 4 and then there's a kick of enormous torque.

It's really hard to 'launch' into fast moving traffic and it's guttural and rough to listen to. I like the car when I can push on with the revs held above 2000 but driving it more sedately is a pain. It's also reasonably accomplished at trickling round town, it pulls hard (torque) but more slowly (lower power) at 1200 revs or so.

I'm currently tooling around in an 04 Mondeo 2.0 TDCI, which I assume is the same as the Focus engine of the same size. No real lag, a nice progressive and even delivery of all that the engine has BUT the expense for that is it lacks some of the snatchy grunt that you get at tickover on the VAG units. It's ten times more refined though and doesn't burn oil between services (and it doesn't get treated that gently!).

I do a lot of driving for work and family and if I had to choose one of the cars to do a journey 8 times out of 10 I'd choose the Ford for a combination of engine and comfort.

HTH

Where you based Fruitbat? I'm just outside Stirling and know that particular road pretty well…email in profile…

06 Mk2 2.0L TDCI Focus here (well wife's car). It's done 38k from new and never missed a beat. Easily get mid 40's and even low 50 mpg's on a run.

Dunno about turbo lag. It seems to be like most diesels, narrow powerband but tonnes of power and torque.

She had a Mk1 1.6L petrol before that was a bit more fun to drive despite being gutless. It was a bit lighter, handled better and needed 'driving' more but was just more fun.

I'll probably buy another when this one is due for change. We usually buy her new and keep for 5 years.