Here, first my thoughts goes to the relatives, but I don't get the "car have stereos" so we can have headphones comments. Yes cars have big stereos, but they also have at least 2 mirrors to help you check what's going on behind you, and a set of indicators that can theoretically be activated to help other anticipate your change of directions. We all like to argue about how different bikes are from cars. So maybe it's time to really take into account all the differences…

She rode her bike into the back of a lorry…not sure what effect the music had!

But I'd agree with Juan sheet.

Very sad story 😥

It does seem that some people just don't 'get' what riding a bike means, and just how dangerous it can be on the road.

Al I concur about the irrelevance of the music to the accident. It's just that plenty of people seems to think that riding a bike on public road is only about what's in front…

The comments are funny.

It's just that plenty of people seems to think that riding a bike on public road is only about what's in front…

Oddly, the story backs that proposition up well.

Yup, if she'd missed some audio cue that might have saved her I could see the point but this is just rider error. Very sad but why do we assume not wearing headphones would have made any difference?

I commute with headphones… Doesn't make any difference to how I ride. What difference would it make if I heard a car behind me? "Uh oh, a car, I'd better stop swerving all over the road?" I can hear horns and sirens and most other noise is irrelevant. IMO of course, I won't tell anyone else to do the same but in my opinion the risk is exactly zero.

Now, riding into the back of trucks, on balance i would recommend against.

How was that accident in any way caused by her listening to music? The way it reads she just rode straight into the trailer. Did she have her eyes shut?

Very sad but the following:-

"Ms Britton-Prior said: “I was always shouting at Amber to take her headphones off when she was cycling but she never listened to me."

is a little bit funny, n'est pas ?

I ride on the road with headphones all the time (for the last 15years), not going to ride into the back of any lorries.
She failed to stop at a junction, what? cos she couldn't hear the Give Way sign? How is her headphones at all relevant. Jeez.
But she was ignorant to the dangers of the road and thought she was invincible
Well, I'm not & I don't.

She rode her bike into the back of a lorry…not sure what effect the music had!

+1, unless she was head banging with her eyes closed or something, the music doesn't seem to have played any part in this.

I often ride with music. I don't think it stops you hearing cars at all.

This comment..

That is one reason I never bought an i-pod as I kept reading stories of cyclists being killed by them. I opted for an i-river B30 instead as I have never read a news story of anyone being killed listening to one.

Another sad story of a poor cyclist killed by their failure to look which is somehow then blamed on their sense of hearing.

Sums it up, I think. And its amazing how many people take the first part seriously? lol?

I nearly rode into the back of a people carrier this morning because I was half asleep and not paying attention. No headphones on though.

If wearing headphones you have to be careful about moving out, e.g. to turn right or overtake a parked car, and make sure you have a good over the shoulder look. Maybe thats what happened to her; she was forced into the trailer by a passing car.

Not just the cyclists though, regularly on my commute there are pedestrians on the cycle/walkway listening to their mp3 players unaware as I try to warn them with the bell or the occasional 'Careful/Coming through'

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/197436

The inquest heard that she had been pedalling along a cycle lane but failed to stop at a junction and slammed into the rear of a Volvo truck trailer that was turning into a side road.

From reading that it seems to me that maybe the headphones at least stopped her from realising that the truck was there since presumably she's have heard it otherwise. Obviously looking would have done the same but I honestly don't believe anyone who says that they regularly ride on the road and have never failed to notice something, particularly if they've been a bit dozy/distracted/whatever.

If your riding at any decent speed you can't hear cars behind you anyway, due to the wind noise.

Yes you can. Not very well but you do hear them. And my hearing's crap!

cheers_drive do they close the roads for you?

Reading between the lines of the article, I suspect that the big headphones were symptomatic of other behavioural traits on the bike: 'she was ignorant to the dangers of the road and thought she was invincible'.

I think we've all seen that sort of rider. lots of them in Edinburgh certainly.

What difference would it make if I heard a car behind me? "Uh oh, a car, I'd better stop swerving all over the road?"

Actually it makes a huge difference. It makes it easier to tell when some idiot has floored it in order to get ahead of you so they can turn left, hence cutting in front of me so I know to back off a bit before the inevitable car/ bike interface.

I think there a lot of folks on here kidding themselves…

…it's not about whether she should have seen or heard the hazard – it's about general attentiveness and concentration when riding.

The very absence of which we criticise car drivers for 👿

I commute with headphones… Doesn't make any difference to how I ride. What difference would it make if I heard a car behind me? "Uh oh, a car, I'd better stop swerving all over the road?" I can hear horns and sirens and most other noise is irrelevant. IMO of course, I won't tell anyone else to do the same but in my opinion the risk is exactly zero.

+1, totally. A few hundred cars pass me on every road ride, I can't tell the difference between the engine noise of one which will over take me and one which will mow me down. I find on the odd occasion I don't use headphones I hear 'phantom' cars, I think the reduction in wind noise from ear buds makes me more aware if anything. Not wanting to preach to people, but this story, whilst sad, is rather stupid.

Sound like one of these stupid bike paths on the pavement where you have to give way at every junction despite the road running parallel having priority. Music aspect seems to be completely irrelevant but it's the current thing to lampoon cyclists over.

Rider error, sad as it is. Personally I'll carry on listening to music on solo road training rides thanks.

I can't tell the difference between the engine noise of one which will over take me and one which will mow me down

I can tell when they're coming up close or giving me a wide berth, from a good 10-15 feet back. Do you not have 3d hearing? Then again, maybe it's cos you're wearing headphones 🙂

I have ridden with headphones, then I stopped because I stopped kidding myself that I was just as aware of traffic.

BoardinBob – Member

"It makes it easier to tell when some idiot has floored it in order to get ahead of you so they can turn left, hence cutting in front of me so I know to back off a bit before the inevitable car/ bike interface."

Um. How do you know they're not just overtaking? Psychic hearing?

clubber – Member

"From reading that it seems to me that maybe the headphones at least stopped her from realising that the truck was there since presumably she's have heard it otherwise."

It was directly in front of it- she failed to see it because she wasn't looking, do you think she'd be paying any attention to what she could hear in that case? She's ignored or failed to use the most important sense so expecting a less important one to make a difference doesn't make any sense to me.

I wear headphones on my commute, it doesnt stop me looking where I am going, around me generally or the periodic look behind rather like you would do in your mirrors when driving.

You should be completely aware of whats is around you but unlike sight I don't think hearing is essential. Are deaf people allowed to drive a car/cycle? I am presuming they are.

"Are deaf people allowed to drive a car/cycle? I am presuming they are. "

Straw man that to be fair- being allowed doesn't mean it's just as good. Deaf people are allowed to go to the opera but I bet they don't enjoy it much

I don't think hearing is essential

😯

I flippin well do!

How do you know they're not just overtaking? Psychic hearing?

Well, if you hear them coming up behind you and then you hear them brake when they're alongside (or almost) then you have a good inkling something's up. And then when the noise gets closer you know they are turning into you..

Blimey, how do you lot manage on the roads?!

If we had proper cycle infrastructure she'd probably be alive. People in Denmark, in Holland, in Sweden can cycle with their children sat in their box at the front distracting them, while talking on their mobiles and shopping bags dangling from the handlebars and make it safely to school or work. Remember, it is the motor vehicle that killed her.

Build decent and comprehensive segregated bike lanes and watch the cycling rate increase and the death rate fall. When will we learn? I hate this macho "well she should have been a better/more hardcore/less invincible feeling rider…" NO! She was just trying to get to work like a normal human being, she shouldn't have to suffer and fear for her life every day, because that's what our current transport system makes me do just so I can get about the city.

Sorry for the rant.

Build decent and comprehensive segregated bike lanes

Where?

I cycle through Central London every day wearing headphones and have never felt any less safe. If you obey the traffic signs and stay aware of the traffic around you then there ain't a problem. The noise of the city drowns out any ability to hear individual cars.

HOWEVER … If I was cycling around the north york moors or say Devon – with those crazy high hedges and twisty blind bends – I would probably think twice – simply because drivers tend to be less careful and more reckless driving about quiet country roads (and at higher speeds!) Then it would be worth hearing them coming!

I hate to sound sexist, but the degree of sheer carelessness that I see women display cycling round london appalls me – they make up something like 95% of fatalies … Just breezing across junctions without a care!!

For those that know it – I was at the junction outside tufnell park tube yesterday – the one with 6 exits.. a woman completely mis-timed her red-jumping and wobbled straight into oncoming traffic – She was lucky not to have been hit

allthepies, that's exactly my first thought…………….sad story all the same.

Where?

Every city and town, and in much of the countryside, much like they do in some European countries, like Holland.

sad story and luckily i never do

If your riding at any decent speed you can't hear cars behind you anyway, due to the wind noise.

Sorry, I know you and njee are cycling god but I have never had this wind noise you are referring too… But I give you that I only commute on the road bike, so no point going over 30 km/h.

As mol-no hander grips I too use the fact that my hears are 3D compatible. So the sense of sound tells me where the car is with respect to me 1 m, 50 cm, 10 cm etc etc. It did save me from a crash, or abled me to clip a wing mirror a few times… But obvisouly if I was riding at the supersonic speed you guys are riding, maybe sound would be useless…

molgrips – Member

Build decent and comprehensive segregated bike lanes

Where?

Just divide the roads up differ3ently – more for bikes, less for cars. Its what they do in Holland. Every traffic / roads planing bod should go and ride a bike there

molgrips – Member

"Well, if you hear them coming up behind you and then you hear them brake when they're alongside (or almost) then you have a good inkling something's up. And then when the noise gets closer you know they are turning into you."

Once they're alongside you should have them in your peripheral vision anyway. "When the noise gets closer", are you serious? Hearing's a precise tool but it's not that precise. And it's far less useful than your eyesight, which is what you should be using to learn about a car that's passing you. I guess if your visual obs are awful then hearing could be of more use, you're blind in your right eye or you never look anywhere but dead ahead in tunnelvision mode.

The scenario you describe just makes no sense. When people overtake you then cut you up turning left they don't do it by trying to drive straight through you, they try and get past then turn across and if you fail to see that coming then your hearing won't help you either, you'll learn far more from your eyes. And even if it did make sense- in this hypothetical situation where people gun it to come alongside then instantly turn into you while alongside (ie, they're not trying to pass you, but actively trying to murder you) what are you going to do? Jump off the bike every time someone overtakes?

Just divide the roads up differ3ently – more for bikes, less for cars. Its what they do in Holland. Every traffic / roads planing bod should go and ride a bike there

Or maybe they should read Monderman's thesis on shared space and not divide anything up.

Back to the debate, if you want to deprive yourselves of a key sense and factor in added distraction to an already potentially hazardous situation, then as adults, I think you should be perfectly entitled to do so.

I hate to sound sexist, but the degree of sheer carelessness that I see women display cycling round london appalls me – they make up something like 95% of fatalies …

In 2008, 84% of the 115 fatalities were men and 81% of reported injuries were to men. Even taking into account the higher numbers of men cycling (72% v 28%) women aren't making up a higher proportion of the fatalities

I hate to sound sexist, but a lot of men speak out of their arses…

Back to the debate, if you want to deprive yourselves of a key sense and factor in added distraction to an already potentially hazardous situation, then as adults, I think you should be perfectly entitled to do so.

+1 to this. Also to Northwind and Juan for calling the "Deaf people manage, don't they?" and "Cars have stereos, don't they?" arguments respectively- both pretty facile.

nothing against people wearing headphones… BUT…….

they do affect your situational awareness, I see plenty of people wearing them riding everyday,some in ear, others closed cup, wouldn't do it myself,

What bothers me the most is seeing people, usually young ladies walking through some of the less populated areas of the city while listening to their ipods etc, absolutely asking
to me mugged,raped,murdered or worse, they wouldn't even know You/I/Us* where there until it was all over 😐

*delete as appropriate

personally i prefer to listen to the sound of my chain, the birds, my lungs and heart, I've always felt that if i needed music to make my ride enjoyable then something is wrong in my life.. but that's me , not everyone's the same.