• This topic has 86 replies, 32 voices, and was last updated 14 years ago by hora.
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  • And exactly why are our Soldiers dying to defend Afghanistan from the Taliban?
  • hora
    Free Member

    I've been reading an interview with Ed Butler, recently retired commander of British forces in Afghanistan. He said he thought British forces would have to stay in Afghanistan for 10 or 20 years to "prevent the direct threat of al-Qaeda launching an operation from Afghanistan" (presumably against the UK). But I wonder how he knows this and suspect it's more of a guess. Wouldn't it be much cheaper to exchange the certainty of death or traumatisation to British troops and "unfortunate collateral damage" for the unknown risk of zero or more terrorist casualties in this country ? What better way to support the troops than to remove them from harm's way ? The recent terrorist bombing in this country was carried out by British citizens, not Afghans, and they may all have better things to do than wasting their time trying to kill a few Brits. We could spend some of the money patching up those damaged by the war.

    1. First rule of war. Make do the dying not you (this also means fight on someone elses territory).
    2. First rule of politics in war. Make sure foreign civilians die. Not your own civillians. This loses elections.

    Todays bombings in Iraq and violence in Afghanistan show that our direct involvement is causing death to innocent men, women and children in a foreign country.

    anokdale
    Free Member

    Ed Butler was Commander British Forces (AFG) in 2005-2006, he handed over command in Oct 2006, at that time we only had 5000 troops over there, he was the first Commander with remit to go on the offensive in Helmand, having served with him since 1989 to 2005 i have great respect for him and i suspect you will see his name appearing among the Chiefs of Staffs in the not too distant future.

    He was the first to ask for more helos, troops and the like so i would bet he is somewhere near the mark with his timeline.

    Granted the Tube bombers were UK citizens but where did they go to learn their trade and complete the doctrine ?? You need to go deep ino the beast to stop this one from coming back at you but the civillian deaths are not acceptable, mind you now we have handed over the prisons aNd legal system to the Iraqi Government watch the figures rise again over there !! Shia pay back time.

    hora
    Free Member

    You need to go deep into the beast. Yes. You need to look closer to home.

    A generation of young men are growing up struggling with their cultural identity, lack of jobs/economic strife in areas across the North including Burnley, Leeds etc etc. When the life went out of the mills, immigrants still kept on coming into the areas.

    As Ive said before, how many of the BNP sympathises are actually racist or disgruntled that too many mouths are trying to eat at the same diminshed table?

    There isnt a black and white answer and 'killing the mothership in Afghanistan/Pakistan wont stop matters.

    Where does radicalism start? Where are the fighters coming from? Arabs? What about Saudi Arabia amending, printing Korans and distributing them globally with additional text 'like the Jews' inserted?

    Fight the problem at the source, dont fight problems on no mans land.

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    anokdale
    Free Member

    Hora – Agreed but we are spending a real amount of resouresS on fighting it in our Country but as you said if the Saudis and the rest spread hate because that is what it is in their countries the radical element will bring the fight to us, so identifying at source and dealing with it there has to be the option. The services dont make it up when they say an individual goes off to Pakistan, AFG, Yemen etc to visit the Madrassas.

    Hell of a mess and not helped in any form by the Right Wing element gaining support in he UK.

    It depresses me that one of the Tube bombers came from Leeds, my hometown, he had the education, healthcare and future that many envy so why and what sends a lad like that over the edge towhat he did ? How can you combat that type of threat. ?

    hora
    Free Member

    anokdale, they (like white etc) turn to drugs, searching for their meaning in life. A strong religious heritage offers them an identity I guess when they have exhausted everything else and they havent made anything of themselves.
    It offers them respect in their community and a feeling of worth.

    ernie_lynch
    Free Member

    but where did they go to learn their trade and complete the doctrine ??

    You can do all that in just one room – you don't need a whole country to learn how to make bombs and become radicalised.

    The 7/7 bombers became radicalised in Leeds and Huddersfield. Probably by watching their TVs and seeing what was happening in places such Iraq.

    But what makes you think that there is anything to stop radicalised kids now going to a lawless country such as Afghanistan ? Eh ? Tell me. And what is there to stop them going to Pakistan ? Or maybe they could go to Sudan ? Would you like to see British troops in Sudan too ? And why do you feel that it is necessary for them to go to another country to learn how to make a simple and unsophisticated bomb ?

    The whole Afghanistan cock-up has nothing at all to do with fighting terrorism. And everything to do with the failed and now completely discredited, legacy of a Bush, Rumsfeld, and Cheney. Their goal was "full-spectrum dominance" and both Rumsfeld and Cheney were heavily involved in 'The Project for the New American Century'. The half-wit idiot George Bush, just did what he was told.

    hora
    Free Member

    From growing up in Huddersfield. I had alot of Asian friends. The bitterness was there deep. All my friends had experienced racism. Even my GF- went to a Bakers shop having seen a sign asking for staff- told 'none/its gone'- the board was still up for a week after.

    I asked my bestmate from college why he hated the Police soo much- his brothers had been stopped and searched countless times.

    Try being Asian or black in the North in a poor area. Being white makes you try to emphasise.

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