Are there any? (not discs before anyone suggests it)

mini v’s? i swaped to basic tektro mini vs and stops superb

What’s the tyre clearance like?

Paul’s if you want some bling.

Tektro mini vs are brilliant and dirt cheap. Don’t let the price put you off…

i run 35mm x kings with shed loads of mud clearance

Avid Ultimates 😀

Or, if you’re worried about clearance, Tektro 720 cantis, Shimano CX70 cantis, TRP offerings – there’s loads out there. What don’t you like about the Shortys?

Nothing really John. I’ve got Avid Shorty 4 on the back and some generic Tektro cantis on the front which aren’t very good so was thinking I could get a Shorty to match the back or replace both if there’s something better. But would like to run short mudguards and 32c-ish tyres

Mini Vs might limit your mudguard choice – seem to remember I had issues.

The CX70s are worth a look if you’re upgrading. And Ultimates really are very good & can be had around half price now (still expensive, mind).